Thread regarding University of Phoenix layoffs

You know how you can tell when a business is failing?

When managers do everything to get people enrolled, then call those targets names behind their backs. When the business blames its advertising firm for not being able to get more vulnerable prospects. When people get sick because they cannot take the grinding work of lying and ripping people off all day. A business is also doomed when people are fired for telling the truth, leaving only the criminally minded at the top, and the stupid and economically desperate in the middle and bottom. The student numbers were once 470,000. Now it's 85,000. The numbers are so terrible that UoPX won't publicly disclose them. The Koolaid has to be mixed so strongly now that the few who do know better nervously call it Jonestown U.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif

70 replies (most recent on top)

Going back to an old (and failed) tv advertising campaign.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-16kme

Using "diversity" to sell subprime.

https://milwaukeecourieronline.com/index.php/2019/08/23/black-male-educators-and-the-lack-of-diversity-in-classrooms/

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-Qbjg

#1 for GI Bill complaints

https://www.rallypoint.com/shared-links/gi-bill-comparison-tool

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-Iqcs

When an old slogan seems so crazy.

"An education toward a career. Total no-brainer."

https://www.facebook.com/CollegeMeltdown/

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-Iqbl

You know UoPX is failing when the only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-Hbru

Yeah, especially an article with such a neutral title ;)

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-Fbcz

You know it's bad when one of the most viewed articles (20K+) on Rally Point is this:

https://www.rallypoint.com/answers/why-do-so-many-veterans-choose-university-of-phoenix-rather-than-more-legitimate-options-like-community-colleges-or-public-universities?page=8&urlhash=4889104

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-Bxsl

This phone conference transcript says it all in its obvious template five finger discount boost from the UOP business model debacle. A few highlights:
'Leveraging on our success in education, we are applying our technologies and capabilities to priority market needs including recruitment, retention, and the learner experience, which is creating a long runway (brilliant now defunct Eastern Airways allusion and metaphorical steal)) for growth. (makes sense). — long live 'technologies and capabilities)...'and the hat tip to retention and learner experience...
Despite: the following often mumbled non sequitur flip-flop...
'...Even though it's a rather (small number) in the grand scheme of things, particularly, when you're talking about six consecutive quarters of improvements...other than in (retention and learner experience) and that sort of thing...'
'Even though it's a rather (small number) in the grand scheme of things...other than in retention...?'

It's always heartwarming to be the most important but rather (small number), retention dumping non-source of revenue ie., the coding student, in the 'grand scheme' of things.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-Byfy

When you can't tell if you are doing as poorly as your competition.

https://seekingalpha.com/article/4282935-zovio-inc-zvo-ceo-andrew-clark-q2-2019-results-earnings-call-transcript

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-Bzuo

When a business magazine has to use old numbers to promote UoPX.

https://flbusinessdaily.com/stories/512867011-graduates-earn-354-degrees-certificates-from-the-university-of-phoenix-florida

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-zcwj

@Just Saying, and this came from "UOP Student of Los Angeles, CA," someone who gave 5 stars.

Cons

  1. Some employers still have a bias towards the University of Phoenix and other for-profits schools. Certain hiring managers and recruiters will pick graduates from other schools first. So I would recommend going to a state or private college if you can. I do not recommend the University of Phoenix to anyone under the age of 25. I would encourage people 18 - 24 years of age to go to a traditional four-year college or enroll in community college and then transfer.
  1. The team assignments are frustrating. Since UOP accepts anyone with a high school diploma or GED, a significant amount of students are indifferent, have poor work ethics, and are not good writers. Therefore, it is extremely annoying to work on a learning team with people who are only attending to receive their degree and do not care about the grades that he/she receives on an assignment. If you are someone who cares about grades, then you will have to take on additional responsibilities while working on team assignments.
  1. If you decide to attend UOP with the hopes of getting a well-paying job immediately, then this might not be the place for you.

I notice that a lot of complaints are about the financial aspects of attending UOP. I cannot comment on this based on my experience because my employer paid for 80% - 85% of my tuition. I have heard that the recruitment process at most non-profit colleges is unethical...and that needs to change. My assessment of UOP is that you get what you give. If a person expects that a degree will be a magic wand that will transform their lives completely, then they are deeply mistaken. Earning a degree will be a significant accomplishment for me. Do I expect to advance in my career? I would hope so, but I have no expectations. Fortunately, I already have a career, and I earn more money than a lot of people with degrees from prestigious colleges. People should have realistic expectations of a for-profit college. If this is your only option, then make the best of it, or you should work harder to get into a private, nonprofit university.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-zmza

Some of the sterling 4 and 5 star reviews Of UOP:
'It never ceases to amaze me the lack of accountability people choose to use as a scapegoat [UOP] for their fallbacks.' ( I know Nicky! It's all their fault Those no accountability people are always bad people and scapegoat like crazy)
Nicole of Maryland Heights, MO
I see so many negative reviews on this school, and I don’t know how. I have been at UOP for 6 months... and I haven’t had not one problem. (Give it another 6 months and $20k and check back with me Katty)
Katara of Stone Mountain, GA
'Daniel was amazing. He always called to check in and ask me how I was doing, and if I felt that I needed help somewhere or if he could provide me with study sessions and whatnot. I attended classes' (So I take it the "whatnot" was pretty good, kinda value added. God bless that Danny. He's a saint)
Kayla of Paragould, AR
' Rich learning environment with access to the best online libraries in the world. Challenging but rewarding academic task...Unserious students will find a reason to complain.'
Eugene of N—ria, Other ( I agree. Always default, it's easy, regardless of the great libraries, even if they reside in N—ria, Other)
' I wanted to be able to talk to the teacher face to face but could not, and they have graduation ceremonies too far from me to attend to get my diploma. Also, I keep getting phone calls and a lot of emails after I graduated two years ago.' (Phone calls? Emails? From UOP? No way.)
Sandra of Owensboro, KY

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-zdbs

is this enough?

https://www.consumeraffairs.com/education/online-colleges/phoenix.html?page=2#sort=recent&filter=none

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-yifa

And even more

https://www.petition2congress.com/ctas/forgive-all-student-debt-accrued-through-university-phoenix

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-yohq

More signs.

https://www.thelayoff.com/t/101QbLW7

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-ygmt

Strayer and Capella picking up the slack from the other failing subprime colleges, especially on the east coast, from NJ to Atlanta.

https://www.thelayoff.com/t/10emvb25

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-tnsc

@Just Saying, I think the anger comes from losing all the government welfare (Title IV, GI Bill, DOD TA, MyCAA). It's hard to imagine losing a middle-class life with all the benefits. It's like a social death.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-qawi

@ZR2oIif-ldyk
You would think that working for a quasi educational contrivance like UOP, while perennially and willfully ruining lives with malice aforethought, would somehow before long sate the 'Anger' stage of the Kubler-Ross paradigm.
But then again with middle class claim to fame slowly dwindling away, why give up unbridled anger for a mere 'Depressing' conscious cleansing mea culpa? No fun in that.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-qwfx

@ Just Saying, I'm not sure you will get much of a response. However, I have faith that some are listening. It can't be easy contemplating giving up a "middle class" lifestyle. Desperation and fear are all a part of UoPX, regardless of the bravado. For many of the full-time workers that remain, especially in management, it's like talking to hardcore gang members who haven't been down for a great deal of time.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-ldyk

@ZR2oIif-kobq
I know this is ever so cruel of me, maybe over the top, I sincerely hope not, and I hesitate to be hurtful and open up old wounds regarding LB but as they say the 'apple does not fall too far from the tree.' So in light of the ongoing consciousless victimization of veterans throughout the land by UOP and those who we so love and thank for their service each and every day I would invite you to reference the sad demise the original founder of the Apollo Management Group to help shed light on how the pangs of conscience or most likely the infamy of jailing might compel a person to 'do the right thing.'

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-lhcw

Here's more on the Apollo deal with Hostess. The problem with University of Phoenix is that teachers are not robots and students are not Twinkees.

https://docedwardsfitness.com/twinkie-revival-why-the-rebirth-of-twinkies-affects-your-health-and-your-pocketbook/

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-lnbk

@Just Saying, that was the old days when disgraced executives jumped out of windows. Now they just find a way to profit from it. DBL blew up the junk bond markets and LB was part of that fiasco. But he just picked up lots of those pieces as MM went to prison. Since then, LB has had smooth sailing as the high sultan of debt, the robber of c-sinos (how amazing is that?), and the emperor of Twinkee robots.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-kobq

It pains me to say this but considering the trashed lives involved with the UOP debacle maybe LB would contemplate jumping out of a window also; but only if it's his choice, fairly unfettered and unemotionally transactional.
That way I too could go on with my life not having to be burdened with not having a conscience either.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-jvqp

@ZR2oIif-jmfi, sure. LB, UoPX's master, is also one of the masters of vulture capitalism. Worked with MM for M&A at DBL during that fiasco.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/10/business/dealbook/how-the-twinkie-made-the-super-rich-even-richer.html
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmKXbcAYpyU&t=1261s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOVHY-Ss2y8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpFOPHUhRBg
https://nypost.com/2019/07/16/charity-in-hot-spot-over-epstein-connection/

"Can you clarify what the robot king is"

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-jodj

Can you clarify what the robot king is

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-jmfi

At this point, people at UoPX and Apollo, especially at the higher levels, need to be asking, how much damage am I contributing to? You don't have to believe me, but over the years, there are others in business, rich people, who have approached me with their deepening concerns, probably because of their spiritual beliefs. But it hasn't happened with Apollo and I don't see it happening when you look at the Twinkee robot king and the remnants of Milken et al. Check this out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QSRsitnXeg

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-ixry

That is interesting about none of the phone numbers working. Everything is always changing, but not for the good. It would make sense that the phone numbers don’t work. As far as teachers, they may be listed but not actually be given any classes to teach since there aren’t many. Essentially ghost teachers who have probably already moved on.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-itcq

You know another way you can tell a business is failing? when none of the telephone numbers in the 2019-2020 academic catalog work, except for 844-YES-UOPX.

https://www.phoenix.edu/content/dam/altcloud/doc/catalog/phoenix.pdf

Just wondering, are all the faculty of UoPX listed really still teaching classes? ITT Tech had a bogus list before they went under. Does UoPX have ghost teachers along with ghost campuses?

https://www.phoenix.edu/content/dam/altcloud/doc/colleges_divisions/school-business-faculty.pdf
https://www.phoenix.edu/content/dam/altcloud/doc/colleges_divisions/college-education-faculty.pdf
https://www.phoenix.edu/content/dam/altcloud/doc/colleges_divisions/college-health-professions-faculty.pdf
https://www.phoenix.edu/content/dam/altcloud/doc/colleges_divisions/college-humanities-sciences.pdf
https://www.phoenix.edu/content/dam/altcloud/doc/colleges_divisions/school-advanced-studies.faculty.pdf

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-hgnx

@ZR2oIif-gbsl, Just like this from the Twinkee Robot King?

https://nypost.com/2019/07/16/charity-in-hot-spot-over-epstein-connection/

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-hkdr

What are ridiculous discussion Dahn is having with home self here :)

And how clueless.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-gbsl

Yes, there are other "jobs" out there in this great Trump economy. You can work for Zovio or Grand Canyon if they are still hiring. Maybe the latest coding bootcamp. There's underwriting for personal loans, selling used cars, getting a real estate license, the latest in multi-level marketing.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-gjxr

@ZR2oIif-eiiy, here's "the plan," in fable form.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f96p-IhcZhQ

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-epai

For anyone saying that things are on an upswing or even stabilized, I am truly not seeing that. The university continues to lack any clear vision moving forward. Not even sure what their plan is?!? Does anyone know what the vision is for the next year? 5 years? I’m not seeing or hearing much on a clear plan?

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-eiiy

Your boss, the man who made it possible that Twinkees could be made by robots. Why can't we do the same for UoPX?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHy3nz7Rfzk&fbclid=IwAR2SBRMgWRJQd_2Q-9xPCBvNS2mSEyMDWiPo32pmVD9WvnMZ73ExREd-ILY

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-edap

@ Just Saying, there is a familiar pattern when a subprime college dies, though it could be argued that the Phoenix never dies–it always rises. I might agree. It's hard to believe Apollo Global will extract nothing out of the $1.1B they invested and all the losses they have taken since then.

Anyway, the patterns of grief among subprime college workers are not that different from when a person dies: denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance. In terms of denial, some of the hardcore probably think that you are me–they are that deranged. It's part of the denial and the paranoia of the Phoenix culture.

https://grief.com/the-five-stages-of-grief/

Middle class people at Apollo and UoPX, who drank the Kool-Aid too long by screwing with working families, may struggle finding work making the same money. Those below you, the student debtors, have little sympathy for you and your bills. Better do something before the next downturn. People may think this is college enrollment thing is counter-cyclical, that things will get better for the school if the economy tanks, but in my opinion it's unlikely this time.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-dhrb

Colorado Springs on PEPS Monthly School Closing list. How many zombie campuses are still operating?

https://www2.ed.gov/offices/OSFAP/PEPS/docs/jun19sec1.pdf

11 days ago by Dahn (CollegeMeltdown.blogspot.com) | 14 reactions (+8/-6)
Post ID: @ZR2oIif-
Makes sense until...

  1. 'No one except C-level folks know the real situation' (makes sense)
  2. 'My local campus is not enrolling.' (makes sense)
  3. 'It is more covert than ever.' (makes sense)
  4. 'Distrust reigns and so does dysfunction.' (makes sense)
  5. 'I am surprised that anyone cares and is productive...' (makes sense)
  6. 'Even a radical change in leadership and culture are unlikely to right this sinking ship...' (makes sense)
  7. The folks I know are hanging on for severance.' (nothing new there, follows a pattern)
    And then there's this....
  8. 'There is no conceivable way Phoenix can stay the course for more than {3-5 years} given competition, reputation, and current leadership, systems and culture. Even a radical change in leadership and culture.' (non sequitur!!!)

So WHAT SCHOOLS are defunct , in teach out, or actually doing so well they will continue for the next 3-5 glorious years?

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-dbxi

Oh @ZR2oIif-cntm, check this out too.
https://www.va.gov/gi-bill-comparison-tool/profile/21907103

Complaints by type (Each complaint can have multiple types) This campus/All campuses
Financial Issues (e.g., Tuition/Fee charges) 150/334
Quality of Education 86/185
Refund Issues 25/55
Recruiting/Marketing Practices 65/145
Accreditation 47/115
Change in degree plan/requirements 24/68
Student Loans 89/200
Grade Policy 26/56
Transfer of Credits 52/127
Post-Graduation Job Opportunities 42/102
Release of Transcripts 23/53
Other 29/66

Will I have to get a FOIA for this?
Guess I can't rely on more employees to be honest. You got rid of so many good people and kept so many crooks–although the biggest crooks bailed. Now, generally, it's either dishonest to the core (management), too desperate and afraid (lower levels), or insanely naive (new employees?).

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-dyod

@ZR2oIif-cntm, email me. By the way, do you know the difference between University of Phoenix and a Twinkee? Here's the answer.

https://www.thelayoff.com/t/HLFlHVv

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-cyhw

Students who use GI Bill are not “overcharged”. Dahn, please provide proof of your claims before making them.

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-cntm

It may only be a matter of time before someone in a high enough position informs the media about the systemic fraud at UoPX. That is, detailing and documenting who has made the decisions to continue enrollment fraud and to continue overcharging people using the GI Bill. There doesn't have to be a digital trail if people have been taking good notes with names, times, and places. Just because the Department of Education has looked the other way in the Arthur Green case, that doesn't mean that the insanity will continue.

https://employment.findlaw.com/whistleblowers/how-to-be-a-whistleblower-and-keep-your-job.html

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Post ID: @ZR2oIif-cpth

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