Thread regarding Wells Fargo & Co. layoffs

While i dont share AH tone, they are not wrong. Looking at some of your comments-
1- if your manager isnt discussing this with you they are setting you up for failure and an IM rating. Anyone not meeting the requirement is supposed to be showed the stats monthly and discussed. There are Teamworks stories on the RTO in-office reporting dashboard.
2- Unless you were just hired and the expectations not explained to you, the 8 hours is nothing new. Most teams were 8 hours per day when we returned from Covid.
3- You know where you live and where you decided to work. You determined your drive time. Its not the firms fault.
3- the hour it takes you to get ready for work is not work related in any way, shape or form.
4- Yes the offshore concern is valid. That needs to be addressed with your manager.

We all hate the 8 hour requirement but it is what it is. The firm has already moved on to the next level of monitoring in tracking computer activity, away time on Teams, etc. Go to another firm and its worse. We are one of the last financial firms doing 3/2 hybrid. 4 days will be here soon unfortunately. Its only going to get stricter for "efficiency".

It’s the new 8 is Great

8 is 8 mo--ns.

@bf care to explain???

Completely inefficient to even go into the office anymore for anything. We have things called laptops. Think about all in general everything it affects. Traffic polution, way of life, financial expenses, wear and tear, fuel vs just sitting at my house in my pajamas at my kitchen table eating bowl of fruit loops having the house to myself with a TV in the background playing. Or nobody on the roads etc.
So much simpler. As an introvert, I wish it would have lasted. I wasn't too bad affected at all at covid. I was kinda used to living like that already to be honest lol.
Covid successfully demonstrated that and that alone in effect, should have started the work from home instead of the office movement. We really blew it with that one. We shouldn't even be having this discussion. It's archaic and outdated.

@ac
Yeah, lay off you guys. Seriously. Your hurting feelings here.
Pfft...
Spoken like a true clockpuncher.
What's next? A comparsion of paychecks?
Thanks for sharing that unique informative insight.
Now go back to your clockpunching job.

Do this at your own risk. Even if your manager isn’t following up with you now, and it seems they have discretion, the year-end practices get mandated from your LOB leadership and HR to ensure consistency. So even if you’re doing your job perfectly with 5 hours in office and nobody’s saying anything now, don’t be surprised if that fact gets used against you at year end to impact your rating and bonus. I have seen it happen last year that someone’s rating got downgraded from exceeds to IM (greatly impacting bonus) because they weren’t going into the office for enough days. In this case the manager was fine with it but the year end rules were enforced throughout the LOB. You can extend this to include hours in office this year.

This whole thread makes me smile that I “go in” for 7.5 hrs 3 days a week. But you’ll never see me. I never sit at a desk or chair. Don’t wander around or hide in a hidden office. I’m there but I’m not.

All that matters is on every report I show as at my location over 50% of badge swipes and in 8+ hrs every time I RTO.

There are plenty of people who dont have to come in to the office ever no matter what. You should find one of those jobs and leave the three days a week jobs to the less accomplished in society. You won't regret it.

@ah (ha) wins for the most constructive comment of the day - took a while to press those four keys AND hold down the CAPS LOCK, eh ?

You, my friend, will achieve exceeds expectations this year

@ah STFU

Rising tide lifts all boats. During the time when office workers were making great strides towards improving their working conditions re: WFH, customer workers who had to be face-to-face were seeing some of the largest jumps in real wages in a generation. If you trade your labor for money, we're all in this together. The cr--s in a bucket mentality (pulling other people down because you have it worse) just betrays how ugly a person's worldview is.

@ac Justifying with “other people have it worse” is not good justification to not want better for yourself.

I don’t want to hear you complain about ANYTHING in life because someone will always have it worse.

I appreciate what I have in life. Yes it could be worse. But it’s hard to accept some things when there is no good reason for it. There is no reason for MY. role that I need to be in office or at least 8 hours in office. When I am home, I am also doing work.

Sure I appreciate the people at the grocery store. But I don’t work at a grocery store… I went to college to get a degree and apply for positions, I feel grateful to have been able to do that, as I know for some it is not so easy. But I don’t need to be in person like some jobs..

@ah You are just bitter.
“I suffer so everyone else should have to suffer.” That’s how corporate keeps everyone in check.

Justifying based on “theres worse out there” is not good justification. Or “being an adult”. Sorry I believe corporate urgency is bullsh-t, and people should have time outside of work to live their life.
This company doesn’t care about you.
Keep being a miserable bootlicker.

Yes some people work longer hours than me. And they don’t have time for a life outside of work. Doesn’t mean they should have to? Doesn’t mean I should have to?
In my field the people I know that work harder/longer also get payed more than me. I don’t want that.

Yes some people’s jobs require them to be in person, on the clock, 8+ hours, 5 days a week. Some people have jobs where they HAVE to be in person in order to get the job done. Some people even prefer in person jobs. Sure. Well I don’t. And I wouldn’t choose a career that required that. There is NO good reason to be in office 8 hours 3 days a week for my position.

And sure I will tolerate it to keep my job, as that is life. And yes I appreciate that it’s better than most situations. But damn, can’t even ask to do less hours in office, so I actually have time for other things in life. Sorry you are brainwashed by corporate America and others don’t wanna live life like you do. I’m sure on your death bed you’ll be thinking about how much you increased shareholder value <3

@aq
Start Time- Badge In at work
End time - Last time on network(Teams activity etc)

@ac The person who made someone else's coffee this morning (I hate the stuff) is in a customer-facing, customer-service role. Same with the lunch worker and the grocery store employee.

I don't interface with any external customers, and I don't produce or provide any goods that have to be manually tracked/accounted for. They also have downtime where they can relax if no customer requests are present or being made.

Every action my job requires is via a remote connection on a computer. Why does it matter if I'm in a WF office? I can do my job just as well anywhere I have network access. On top of that, if I'm not tasked with work, I have to go find work because unlike those service workers, I'm expected to be doing something even if there's nothing to do.

@am You can be logged on for 18 hours a day at home and it doesn't mean thing if you aren't in office long enough.

Badge in Early.
Go home after 5-6 hours.
Fire up the lappy at home and leave it connected till late night.

This can’t be a serious post. “Omg I have to be an adult! Oh what will I do?!”Yes the minimum is 7 or more. Most of us hear from our managers if we average 7.5 hours or less.

The in office requirements are ridiculous and show how broken management is. They don’t know how to monitor quality so they monitor time. However, everyone hates it so ignore it at your peril. I set an alarm and include the 5 minute walk to the door. So they get 8 hours exactly from me.

Much discretion surrounding your vertical (which goes well above your immediate manager). Some, even if the same location have vastly different enforcement...hardline-zero exception vs. comply with the spirit of it but okay to fall a little short regularly.

The reporting tool breaks down by 4/8/12 week views...for now can't drill down to specific hours people were in or out. Also, don't trust the badge swipe in/out to count your time...go by the time you sign on/off.

Quietly ask your manager how diligent they are with it then base your decision on that. Put it in writing and you'll get a canned answer. BUT, understandably, if your manager catches heat for not enforcing it diligently, it will come your way. Bonuses were impacted in some lines of business last year for falling short of the 8 hours...roughly 30% reduction.

If you plan to remain at WF, best to comply & hit the 8-hours. An occasional shortage of 8 won't be harmful as long as that's not the norm. I assure you managers feel the same frustration as you surrounding this...we all report to someone.

The person who made your coffee this morning, the person who prepared your lunch and the person who checks you out at the grocery store in the evenings all also have to work eight hr days and commute to work so perhaps you should be happy you get paid very well and only have to go in three days a week and get to dvck around at home the rest of the time. Or you can keep whining about unfair life is and try to get away with it.

Work less than 8 at your own risk. You may not hear anything for a while (or ever) but when year end evals arrive and they need a sacrificial lamb to get fired they'll absolutely pull the reports and use them as an excuse to get rid of whoevers at the bottom with HRs blessing.

My manager showed me her dashboard. It shows an average, and she can change the parameters as she wishes (quarterly view, monthly, etc). I left early one day due to illness and that didnt do anything for the quarterly average, but did for the monthly view. Sigh. I now manually log my time in and out in my own spreadsheet since no one provides any regular metrics to see how I'm doing. Asinine, yes, but here we are.

I sit near someone who runs a dashboard monitoring hours in office, days in office, and people with flexible work arrangements, and overhear his calls sometimes. What I've picked up on is the threshhold where you get flagged on hours varies significantly by manager and is an ongoing topic of conversation and revision. The guy I was listening to was quietly and politely losing his mind trying to figure out how to build reporting around a bunch of bespoke, individual requirements per manager that were constantly being revised, it was kind of funny. Anyway, they're being deliberately opaque about the threshold with workers, because the moment they make it explicit, everyone will start clocking out at exactly that time and no more, and they know it.

The conclusion I've come to is that, in an environment of moving targets, its not worth gambling with my livelihood just to squeeze out a few extra hours at home. I just do 8 hours +/- a little. I resent it every single day i have to commute in, but it's not worth f'ing with my peace of mind. Any edge you think might identify with the metric is subject to change without notice, and they're actively looking for reasons to performance manage people out. Why roll the dice?

I will say that before Wells came out with the requirement, I would regularly work (or at least be online/available) 9-10 hours a day, and happily take scheduled calls before or after my working hours. I draw much more concrete boundaries on my time now and try to leave each in-office day at 8 hours, regardless if my queue is still overflowing. So its not all downsides, if the c-suite wants to manage exempt employees like clockwatchers, that's exactly the performance they're going to get.

In my line of business, it is 7 hours for the performance discussion trigger

Someone said less than 5 hours is the trigger.
I occasionally do 6 hours and have had no issues.

Haven’t heard a peep from my manager about hours in months.

There's a lot of managerial discretion right now about how/when to enforce. There's a hard line about 3 days/wk) things would get quiet for a while and then out of nowhere a mandate would get handed down about enforcement. So that risk is there with hours in office also.

In the same boat. I feel exactly how you do and the wasted time is really eating at my morale tbh. My manager hasn’t said anything yet, but I’m going to ask to see my numbers.