Thread regarding AT&T layoffs

myob and get back to work

The only area where unions are thriving is in the public sector. That is because their “management” gets to buy their votes in hopes oh keeping themselves in office. In the private sector, unions will be nonexistent in a decade. Maybe some day soon, we will go back to making public sector unions illegal. One can only hope.

Why does management keep micro-managing toxic supervisors? I think the toxics buy drinks for the boss.

good ole boys promoted shows the failed leadership in place. good ole boy network put us in this mess. time to hire real leaders. all the majorty good ole boy network does time after time is rob peter to pay paul. look at where we are in regards to our economy and this company. stop hiring your friends if they will not bring any value to T and America.

Look on the bright side, 10 years from now , this will be the very least of your concerns.

you think you perceive them as lazy because they are leaders and are always being passed up for promotion because of the good ole boy network.

All 100% true. It’s even worse in the core Wireline side of the business (Legacy T union employees are at the bottom of that barrel). “ feigned adversarial tone” is about as nice as you can put it.

@xvj+1nutJdd0
“I managed people (Mobility techs) back in the Cingular days when the unions set up shop in our market. What I saw over time was that the lazier folks tended to gravitate toward Union stewardship and stuff like that. I also noted that those folks, over time, tended to become more vocal, with a feigned adversarial tone in all of their communications. Which most of the time was completely unnecessary and uncalled for, and in a meeting would make them appear foolish and unprofessional. Took lots of liberties being away from assigned work locations on "union business" and stuff like that. Seemed to always be on Fridays for some reason. Never pushed the issue too hard though, easier to just let them be as most were inept and not good at their actual jobs anyway. A couple of these blowhards were caught up in recent surplus events after skating for many years. Was actually pleased to see it”.

Lol, nothing but management complaints for the last 2 months about having to RTO and being forced to move, on top of losing vacation and retirement benefits, but now the unions are bad for standing up to the company that doesn’t care about either of us.

The OP didn't say anything about the management or RTO, for all we know he or she is also a Union employee watching someone they don't feel deserving to be constantly protected by the union, and asking a question.

@aqb+1nutJdd0, um so which side is so un-controlling they want to: ban books, dictate that investment firms may not seek out ESG strategies, won't allow women to control their own health, force businesses to kowtow to their culture wars, restrict rights for LGBTQ+ people, refuse to allow schools to teach things that aren't first approved by government, put limits on what and how healtcare providers operate, and more

All of those are policies championed, embraced, and promoted by the magas. Sounds pretty controlling to me.

I managed people (Mobility techs) back in the Cingular days when the unions set up shop in our market. What I saw over time was that the lazier folks tended to gravitate toward Union stewardship and stuff like that. I also noted that those folks, over time, tended to become more vocal, with a feigned adversarial tone in all of their communications. Which most of the time was completely unnecessary and uncalled for, and in a meeting would make them appear foolish and unprofessional. Took lots of liberties being away from assigned work locations on "union business" and stuff like that. Seemed to always be on Fridays for some reason. Never pushed the issue too hard though, easier to just let them be as most were inept and not good at their actual jobs anyway. A couple of these blowhards were caught up in recent surplus events after skating for many years. Was actually pleased to see it.

Because lazy people pay them.

Dobt worry, very soon Unions will be found only in history books

When you’re RTO’d can you join the union?

When a manager loses 3 grievances because of poor writing skills and it looks like his b-form was scratched with a blunt crayon and the craft employees grievance shows the facts only, not the managers feelings. The manager “is moved to another team”. Ie: fired, or RTO’d…you pick

Unions owe the workers that they represent the duty of representation. If the Union fails to do so, the worker can sue the union for its failure, and claim as damages, costs incurred by the worker (such as suspension from work) that wouldn't have happened had the worker been represented.

Matters that the union can take up is disparity in treatment, such as, other workers with the same deficiencies in work performance have been more leniently treated in the past than the company's proposed discipline for the worker currently in trouble. Is there "just cause" for the current proposed discipline?

The main reason for having a union is to avoid the "at will" employment status, where an employer can fire someone without a reason at all. We all get new supervisors - I would have been out in my 2nd or 3rd year with the lemon of a supervisor that I had, had there been no requirement that termination be for "just cause".

Instead, made it to retirement, promoted to highest level of craft, large 401K, pension, health. Shoot - that is entirely attributable to union representation in my 2nd and 3rd years.

Lol, nothing but management complaints for the last 2 months about having to RTO and being forced to move, on top of losing vacation and retirement benefits, but now the unions are bad for standing up to the company that doesn’t care about either of us.

If management employees were represented by the union, I can bet they wouldn’t be randomly forced to a hub without relocation expenses which they are being forced to do now.

And sometimes managers are told hands off.

Unions are a necessary evil, Imagine how you would be treated if you didn't have one. Your benefits and pay would be sh*t. Also don't be mad at a coworker who has seniority or doesn't have your said work ethic. Worry about yourself and you'll have less stress

Because whether you’re a harder worker or “lazy” and barely meet performance standards they both pay the same amount of dues.

Union contracts are set up to protect the people that have been there the longest not the high performers. When it comes time for layoffs, they don’t look at performance they look at tenure. 130 years ago, unions were illegal. We should go back to that.

As stated below, the Union is legally required but there are degrees of defense. It doesn’t benefit anyone to keep a cancer around, makes more work and trouble for everyone. If someone is deserving to be fired because of being “lazy” then it’s incumbent upon their manager to document and follow the contractual disciplinary process. HR with legals approval does the actual firing.

The Union neither hires or fires company employees, some mangers for various reasons don’t follow the disciplinary process so the employee’s poor performance is never corrected. Most of the time the opposite is true and a lot of managers with direct reports are pressured to be micromanagers and it creates a toxic work environment.

Why do shareholders and BOD defend incompetence in the C-suite or at minimum ignore it?

Lazy is kind of subjective as a description of someone.
It's a lazy description, frankly.
I'm 'lazy' because I post on a weird trauma board into the wee morning hours.
So sue me.

why do they defend others that are lazy ?

They pay dues so the union is legally required to defend them.

Employees not in a right-to-work state can get the portion of their union dues going to political activities refunded annually. Unions are required to defend those craft employees as well since the rest of the dues go to union operations.