Thread regarding Oracle Corp. layoffs

Forced job migration and offices closing as "Class of" takes over - Warn notices to be sent in April

It pays to make friends in people in HR and facilities with Oracle. I've been able to triangulate what is happening, on what appears to be a global scale. At months end (Q3) March 1st 2018 and then the final blow June 1st 2018 as Oracle offices close. Oracle has been extremely quiet on all the layoffs, no comments and no public announcements other than the 10Q where they raised 1.1 billion dollars in severance packages to be paid out by June 1st 2018.

This information is from first hand conversation from people who should know, people in HR and facilities. It is rumor, as they are not high enough in the org to qualify as confirmation, but its also hard not to notice your entire office space being shut down. Not everyone who will be let go over the next 3 to 4 months will be getting a severance package. There is a warn notice that requires notifications if layoffs or terminations are greater than a certain threshold and this varies state by state. The layoffs have been staggered over a year so as to not trip a warn notification unless necessary. There will be a warn notice sent out for June 1st for many states in the US. I do not know the laws for other countries but the whole sale change out of sales to Oracle digital is happening. Product changes are underway. Oracle is about to shut down a great deal of legacy products and go towards a model of skeleton crew support for existing customers. Changes begin March 1st 2018. The warn notices 60 days prior to June 1st will be sent our ironically on April 1st 2018. It would qualify as the worlds most tasteless April fools joke, if it were not real.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worker_Adjustment_and_Retraining_Notification_Act_of_1988

The Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act of 1988 (the "WARN Act") is a US labor law which protects employees, their families, and communities by requiring most employers with 100 or more employees to provide 60 calendar-day advance notification of plant closings and mass layoffs of employees, as defined in the Act

Oracle has not provided notice yet:

http://www.twc.state.tx.us/businesses/worker-adjustment-and-retraining-notification-warn-notices

http://www.twc.state.tx.us/files/news/warn-act-listings-2018.xlsx

What is interesting is that facilities will be closing as well. The number of employees at various office locations have been steadily dropping. Oracle is checkingthe badge counts for people who actually go into the offices, and its way down in certain locations. Shrinkage has already occured as Oracle has closed off certain parts or floors in the buildings they occupy. Now entire Oracle offices will be shutting down. In many cases jobs will litterally be moving to new hubs. For example many people not getting a severance package will be required to move (no expenses paid) to a new city. This is expected to reduce the number of severance packages necessary as people leave voluntarily.

In Texas the new Austin campus will actually force the close of the Frisco office, and perhaps the Irving office in DFW as sales and other jobs litterally move to the new OD campus in Austin. The Austin Oracle Digital Hub is to be completed in March 2018. Texas is an at-will employment state and does not have the "Implied contract" or "covenant of good faith" exception. Oracle can simply terminate the position and the employee with out notice or reason and not pay severance. Texas does have a public policy exception, menaning that you canot be terminated for filing a workers comp claim, for example. Short of that Oracle does not need to follow any rule other than a warn notification. The first push is to close offices in Dallas and force a migration to Austin in March. This should cause a good deal of natural attrition.

From what I understand what is happening in Dallas is happening globally. My counterparts in colorado speak of offcies that are now ghost towns.

Below is a sort of memorial to the fallen, as name plates of managers that got laid off decorate a cube. Its viceral you can feel it everywhere inside Oracle. It will be even more palabale as facilities close.

https://i.imgur.com/C832QvP.jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/At-will_employment

At-will employment is a term used in U.S. labor law for contractual relationships in which an employee can be dismissed by an employer for any reason (that is, without having to establish "just cause" for termination), and without warning. When an employee is acknowledged as being hired "at will," courts deny the employee any claim for loss resulting from the dismissal. The rule is justified by its proponents on the basis that an employee may be similarly entitled to leave his or her job without reason or warning. In contrast, the practice is seen as unjust by those who view the employment relationship as characterized by inequality of bargaining power.

Here is a good breakdown on at-will employment laws and exceptions by state:

https://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2001/01/art1full.pdf

All the hubs for "Class of" are going live. This marks the full roll out of the strategy put in place by MH back in 2013 to replace high salaried workers with lower salaried less experienced workers. The genius of the plan is that a recent college grad is cheaper than the current employee in every corner of the world regardless of the wage descrepancies between nations. All you have to do is offer a clss of program and create a digital hub presense in every country. That is exactly waht Oracle has been doing over the past several years.

http://www.oracle.com/webfolder/joinclassof/index.html

Job opening and qualifications. Basically any college grad with no experience qualifies.

Sales and Business Development Rep - Class Of-17000ZYV

Preferred Qualifications:

• BS or BA degree with a GPA of 3.2 or higher preferred

• 0-2 years work experience

• Able to demonstrate time management, basic telesales skills, knowledge of Oracle products and services (training provided)

• Goal oriented individual with superior communication skills

• Able to complete individual goals as well as work in a team environment

• Demonstrated ability to communicate using technical concepts

• Working knowledge of Oracle products a plus but not necessary

• Professional demeanor

• Desire for a long-term career in sales

• Able to demonstrate critical thinking skills to acquire a higher level understanding of role, processes, and procedures

The class of program and the Oracle digital hubs are global with key hubs in California, Texas and Colorado. I dont know all the locations, and its not exactly easy to find them. I know they are in 6 of the 7 contents, there is no OD hub in antartica, but everything else is covered. Its quite amazing.

Here is a small listing I was able to google for with in a few minutes. The list is by no means comprehensive. The importantthingto realize is that Oracle has "pivoted" and the employees (not recent college grads) are about to feel it in a big way.

http://www.oracle.com/webfolder/join-oracle-direct-lad/index.html

http://www.oracle.com/webfolder/digitalselling/index.html

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/technology/oracle-digital-hub-will-help-lift-smes-to-cloud/news-story/20a3baea3fd75ef7acc912aea6ad017e

https://www.oracle.com/in/corporate/pressrelease/smb-access-cloud-solutions-in-new-oracle-digital-hub-india-20170707.html

http://www.intelligentcio.com/me/2017/01/23/oracle-announces-opening-of-digital-hub-and-first-regional-data-centre/

Just a small listing of the new APAC digital hubs:

Australia and New Zealand

ASEAN

Malaysia:

Kuala Lumpur

Hong Kong

India:

Bengaluru

Delhi-NCR

Mumbai

Korea

SEOUL

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| 12773 views | | 80 replies (last ) | Reply
Post ID: @OP+RDJx64X

80 replies (most recent on top)

Change is a coming. Cubicle move-out time. RB is on his way.

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Post ID: @9szx+RDJx64X

@RDJx64X-8oae: “I bet Dad’s daughter can get herself out of Oracle on her own. This thread is turning into Monty Python sketch.”

And it's because of posters like you, posting useless comments.

Besides, if you read that poster's last comment carefully, he said his daughter aced an interview and got an offer. Sounds like a done deal.

Anyway, this is second-hand rumor, FWIW: there was a big management meeting after all for fusion. Major shakeup in the works, especially for financials. Moving boxes supposedly have been ordered for many buildings. I'm trying to get more details.

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Post ID: @8vrp+RDJx64X

I bet Dad’s daughter can get herself out of Oracle on her own. This thread is turning into Monty Python sketch.

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Post ID: @8oae+RDJx64X

To the dad of the woman developer. Get your daughter out of Oracle. I was a female developer. The management is extremely biased against women developers. The 2 Indian managers I worked for have serious problems working with women. They want them to be inferior and consequently sabotage the women working for them to make their image of them true. Being female and smart at the same time is not allowed. Personally I think there are Indian cultural views of women that are very different from how women are viewed in the US. Women are not allowed to succeed in development. No women managers or architects at all. I also a woman was s-xually assaulted by a manager.

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Post ID: @8uvg+RDJx64X

FWIW, an ESL speaker could be white (white people do speak languages other than English). Assuming that an ESL speaker is a person of color is also racist.

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Post ID: @8dek+RDJx64X

That was a racist statement from @RDJx64X-8car. I felt uncomfortable when I saw it.

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Post ID: @8emm+RDJx64X

Poster @RDJx64X-8car, when you said, “ESL poster... this is NOT fake news.”

That's a racist remark. Why not just quote what was written and use the person's post ID? Instead, you deliberately wanted to point out that he (or she) is a foreigner who is not fluent in English and you discriminated, singling out this person as “ESL poster”. A couple of posts below mentioned the toxic culture of Oracle. Your attitude is part of that decadence.

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Post ID: @8gre+RDJx64X

"I’m still shocked that a parent of an adult worker at oracle is on here posting. This world has gone total mad. His daughter must be horrified."

You obviously don't have any kids, or if you do then you are not very close.

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Post ID: @8zgz+RDJx64X

Big meetings did happen. Clean out your cubicles. RB is on his way.

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Post ID: @8mjh+RDJx64X

ESL poster... this is NOT fake news. Read this post: https://www.thelayoff.com/t/RB96Zju

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Post ID: @8car+RDJx64X

That is Old News guy again. @RDJx64X-7rin and @RDJx64X-7ead have same voice. He insult again old man father. It is good identifying Old News guy so he get shamed.

Other poster @RDJx64X-7vvu claim “I think today's young people used to mom and dad solving all their problems for them. It's called helicopter parenting.”

Not that, I do not see in his post he try solve problem for child. He just want understand news here, thats he said, then I saw first reply where he get insult. Make it this way, I have young son. Not new graduate. Few years out college and working in HPE. We are in layoff life, that is life style in High Tech, and so natural for parent feel sorry for child future. Thats all old man father say. So now I am in HCM, and I talk to manager today that said no big manager meeting on valentine day. That look like fake rumor. Manager is good guy and said Oracle believe in HCM fusion, will make new UX for it. Any layoff will be target area like incremental. I hope he is right. This probably my last post. The manager mention I be careful because HR is probably here.

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Post ID: @7fuv+RDJx64X

"His daughter must be horrified."

I think today's young people used to mom and dad solving all their problems for them. It's called helicopter parenting.

As for the "old news" poster, if he upsets you; them maybe you need to ask yourself why he has that power over you.

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Post ID: @7vvu+RDJx64X

I figure "Old News" poster is here to stop or derail any thread that has some merit so if he/she is posting on it, chances are there is at least some truth to what's being said. Let's not feed the troll or get off topic and start arguing among ourselves. Keep focused on the topics at hand and keep the truly relevant conversation at the top of the active thread for the right reasons.

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Post ID: @7wmd+RDJx64X

Dear Dad of Adult - keep posting please. We are learning so much about you and your family.

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Post ID: @7rin+RDJx64X

I’m still shocked that a parent of an adult worker at oracle is on here posting. This world has gone total mad. His daughter must be horrified.

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Post ID: @7ead+RDJx64X

Guys, keep it civil, personal insults are not allowed here. I'm surprised site admins haven't nuked some of these posts already.

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Post ID: @7juu+RDJx64X

Poster @RDJx64X-7dqa that bother old man. You are really Old News guy? Shame on you! You do mess of this site. And now you bother old man that is father. Make it this way, all parents always worry for children, doesn't matter age. I do same thing. I am father. But why you keep posting “old news” all time? You must stop that. Oracle is big company and is just go change right now. I talk to my manger, and he say fusion apps like the HCM is still good. So I do not know why you bother people that come here. Sometime layoff in fusion will happen. Make it this way, all big companies go like that. But there are customers for the HCM. But I do not understand why you bother people.

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Post ID: @7wau+RDJx64X

@RDJx64X-7dqa:

“So, how old is she? She’s an adult, clearly, if she’s not straight out of college and you’re retired. What is it you really want to know? Why are you here?”

Obviously, you have zero comprehension skills because I clearly stated why I'm here. And she's my youngest, if it's any of your damn business, but I'm not about to reveal her age because of weirdos like you lurking on this site. It's actually hilarious you're probing me. Your antics are ridiculous, even disturbing: why are you wasting time questioning me? If you've been laid off, you should be looking for work, pal. And if you're still an Oracle employee, why aren't you doing your job? Wait I got it: you're the “Old News” dude who so many others keep seeing here, pestering this site. Congrats for coming out, pal.

“Does your grown adult daughter have as short a fuse as you?”

Nah. And not me either. I just like to spank a-holes who go around this site with a condescending attitude.

@RDJx64X-7qfw:

“An experienced Netsuite developer will probably have their pick of job offers. Your kiddo will be just fine!”

Thank you. I just got the news that she did well on an interview and they want to hire her.

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Post ID: @7dnd+RDJx64X

Dear Dad Poster:

This “She’s not in sales. She’s a developer in NetSuite and not a newbie straight out of college. But she, like so many other employees at Oracle are understandably worried about the future of the company.”

So, how old is she? She’s an adult, clearly, if she’s not straight out of college and you’re retired.

What is it you really want to know? Why are you here? Does your grown adult daughter have as short a fuse as you ?

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Post ID: @7dqa+RDJx64X

That is nice of you, Mr. Dad. I am certain your college educated grown child can handle this. Call it a life lesson. If said kiddo grew up watching you in your career experiencing the ups and downs, you did your job. Having said that, know two things: 1. Everyone in a company acquired by oracle is vulnerable. You can guarantee that work life does not get better once you are on the ORCL payroll. 2. An experienced Netsuite developer will probably have their pick of job offers. Your kiddo will be just fine!

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Post ID: @7qfw+RDJx64X

“Dad - your daughter should get out. That’s what folks are saying here. Don t be angry. Just know that they are in the same predicament at your daughter. It’s rare to see a parent on a job board.”

Thanks, and that’s what she’s doing. She’s doing the interview rounds now. I’m not angry, by the way. Just had to put some wack job in his place because of his smart A$S reply. It's people like that who contribute to the bad image of Oracle. Anyway, I’m here because, like any decent parent, I’m concerned about my child’s future; and I’m just trying to get a handle on all the info being tossed around here. I get it that some here are angry, or disgruntled, because of the way Oracle treated them. Been there myself. Laid off in the past from other companies. But it’s getting harder and harder to sense what’s true info here. I think most of it comes from a good intention. But then you got some wack jobs who can’t be objective and end up exaggerating. Anyway, like I said, I know what it’s like to be laid off. And you know what? It doesn’t matter what company: they’re all run by A-holes, but some more than others. The problem with Oracle, based on what I”ve learned from people who work there and from what I sense here, is that it’s not only LE and his cronies who are a-holes. It’s the entire culture that’s been fostered into an a-hole culture. I’m retired now, but I’ve worked for some of the big names in hi-tech, and the reputation of Oracle in all those companies is that Oracle is difficult to work with and full of a-holes. Of course, not all employees are like that. And here I sense some friendly people such as yourself who just want to share some insights about the company. But sadly, Oracle has a horrible reputation that I described.

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Post ID: @7jgd+RDJx64X

This must be a helicopter parent.

Seriously, who’s daddy does this? (That’s normal, I mean.)

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Post ID: @7rpy+RDJx64X

Soooo. We learn from the “DadPoster” that NetSuite folks are now skittish too.

Seems that the good folks in netsuite are already seeing how acquisition by oracle is a death sentence for many. If you aren’t the founder of an aquisituon getting $$$ in the buyout, you’re chattel.

Dad - your daughter should get out. That’s what folks are saying here. Don t be angry. Just know that they are in the same predicament at your daughter.

It’s rare to see a parent on a job board.

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Post ID: @7bde+RDJx64X

“As for the “Dad” poster, you really should’ve helped your daughter during the interview process critically think thru that offer. Zero experience and $50k a year .... there’s a bit more to it now isn’t there.”

Dad poster here. You’re a moron for making that assumption about my daughte’s job. She’s not in sales. She’s a developer in NetSuite and not a newbie straight out of college. But she, like so many other employees at Oracle are understandably worried about the future of the company.So do yourself a favor and join the other moron I spanked earlier and seriously consider my career advice. Have a good life.

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Post ID: @7uzi+RDJx64X

Yep.

The ERP, HCM AND SALES/CX cloud SaaS is all on prem software based. Bubblegum and lipstick is being used to make it “cloud” or SaaS.

As for the “Dad” poster, you really should’ve helped your daughter during the interview process critically think thru that offer. Zero experience and $50k a year .... there’s a bit more to it now isn’t there.

The oracle class if is a glorified call center that’s going to turn North American college grads into highly educated demoralized call center operators. That expensive college education was a waste of money.

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Post ID: @7qvf+RDJx64X

If it’s not cloud based it’s a dinosaur.

The problem is that most of our SaaS revenue comes from services we built on all that "legacy" on-prem software. Without investment in the on-prem stuff, the tech foundation of our cloud has already rotted away to nothing. Think I'm joking? Fusion Apps is still running on WebLogic 10. They can't debug their own code and need all the "legacy" teams to clean up the messes they make. I'm not saying some of this software is not old and behind the times, a lot of it is. But most of our cloud business completely depends on it. Technology wise, our SaaS offerings are already "legacy" from top to bottom.

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Post ID: @6rlh+RDJx64X

And reply to @RDJx64X-6lif, who states “umm, yeah. Duh. If it’s not cloud based it’s a dinosaur.”

Not everyone here is an Oracle employee, so I have no idea about the details of Oracle's product lines. Look, I'm just trying to grasp what the heck is going on at this dump because I got a young daughter who is an Oracle employee. Good thing she's doing the interview rounds so maybe she'll get off this sinking ship and be away from the likes of you who, whether current or past employee, typifies the arrogant A-whole reputation of this company that I've heard about from others in the high-tech industry. Obviously you have zero critical thinking skills to mouth off such a smart A$s reply, which means you need serious career counseling. So let me start you off with some free advice: to hell with you and screw yourself. (What an moron.)

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Post ID: @6egp+RDJx64X

Reply to: Are all on-premise products now considered “legacy”?

😐 umm, yeah. Duh.

If it’s not cloud based it’s a dinosaur.

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Post ID: @6urg+RDJx64X

In the original post: “Oracle is about to shut down a great deal of legacy products and go towards a model of skeleton crew support for existing customers. Changes begin March 1st 2018.”

Are all on-premise products now considered “legacy”?

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Post ID: @6ctk+RDJx64X

I second the #trainwreck. There is zero chance that the kids who, while nice and smart, know next to nothing about enterprise sales and the crappy products that oracle sells will be successful. ZERO! The 3 stooges are cost cutting oracle into irrelevance, just like HP, all while 2 of the plus TK and DD are all selling their oracle shares as fast as they only can. They know it’s over!

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Post ID: @6ndn+RDJx64X

Other companies are doing this as well. Eli Lilly, headquartered out of Indianapolis, just went through VERP (Voluntary Early Retirement Program). About 2600 employees. These aren't 70 year old folks. These were individuals in their early 50's with a great deal of tribal knowledge of the company. in their place, they've hired recent college grads who can't even facilitate meetings.

Yep, it's that bad.

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Post ID: @6gsi+RDJx64X

"Regarding Oracle office closures"

"Can you provide the link or how to navigate to that information?"

Looks like the GIT website has migrated to the cloud since yesterday when I originally found that list. The new site has a lot less information than the old one did, and I can no longer find the list there either.

You can still find it though, from my.oracle.com

Click the link for the "Switch to Oracle’s Next Generation Wi-Fi...." story near the top of the page.

Click on the "deployment schedule" link in the WiFi article.

Click on "Sites Overview" on the left.

This is the same list that I referred to yesterday, but it is in a different format.

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Post ID: @5ejt+RDJx64X

You dont need to worry about it working (this new sales model), it wont.

Here's why:

Even IF the college kids are as AWESOME and SMART as MH says they are, they dont have anything more to sell than the seasoned, experienced pro's do/did. The Oracle Cloud is a nascent venture. While AZURE and AWS and Google Cloud and all the rest are on the 6th or 7th generation cloud architectures... Meanwhile, Oracle is on version 1.

Yep, that's the real story. Its no joke. These cats in Redwood Shores at the top think that the cloud washing deals and "free" cloud software from Oracle HCM, ERP, Service and CX with your annual support renewal will enamor clients into adopting Oracle SaaS, until they DO IT. Then the clients experience what they got was slow, dodgy software in a generation 1 cloud environment that is fraught with errors and outages and no modern features.

Then when it comes time for renewal of THAT SaaS that was "free" and exciting, Oracle gets the KNIFE OUT again and they will TWIST it. This time it will be the kiddos in the HUBS who negotiate. Its going to be fun to watch.

#Trainwreck

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Post ID: @5igx+RDJx64X

You know what would be worse than failure with this new sales paradigm? Success. Because if it works, every tech company in the world will imitate this, and sales engineering will go the way of tech support, IOW a low paid job done in another country.

If you do any sort of a knowledge job that involves a computer, your livelihood is at risk. Sales. Engineering. Support. QA. Accounting. Legal. No one is safe in those positions!

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Post ID: @5nlk+RDJx64X

Regarding Oracle office closures -- if you do a bit of digging on the global IT website in reference to the office wifi upgrades going on, you can find a list of every Oracle office in the world and that list tells you if the office is closing, expanding, shrinking, being retained as is, or a new facility, among other things.

Can someone post the list? I'd like to know what offices are shrinking and or closing for certain. I can't find it.... I'm sure the list is a subset of offices that are going to close, and that not all the ones slated for closure are going to be listed.

Still, I'd really like to know which ones for sure are going to be shut down.

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Post ID: @5ukj+RDJx64X

You know what guys? The layoffs are real, its painful. Its not the end of the world, but the uncertainty stinks. Job hunting stinks, interviewing stinks, and the lack of the pay check stinks. I would not wish getting laid off on anyone.

Ok I take that back. I'd love to see the "old news" guy get laid off. I hope he is the last to go. so when he logs in to tell everyone he got laid off, we can all say "old news."

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Post ID: @5fky+RDJx64X

Old news

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Post ID: @5jbd+RDJx64X

Regarding Oracle office closures -- if you do a bit of digging on the global IT website in reference to the office wifi upgrades going on, you can find a list of every Oracle office in the world and that list tells you if the office is closing, expanding, shrinking, being retained as is, or a new facility, among other things.

Can you provide the link or how to navigate to that information? Does it list the closure dates? It it kept up to date? I guess the last question is... are we sure they (the execs) aren't hiding any information from the people that maintain the list?

I'd like to believe its all ok. But I think false information that I am safe is worse than knowing I'm doomed.

Regarding these... Mgmt finally figured out Aria was a “tell” bc they’d remove individuals before or on the day they were iced. Last year they figured that one out, so now it’s delayed a few weeks before you disappear in aria.

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Post ID: @5tfy+RDJx64X

Regarding Oracle office closures -- if you do a bit of digging on the global IT website in reference to the office wifi upgrades going on, you can find a list of every Oracle office in the world and that list tells you if the office is closing, expanding, shrinking, being retained as is, or a new facility, among other things.

Can you provide the link or how to navigate to that information? Does it list the closure dates? It it kept up to date? I guess the last question is... are we sure they (the execs) aren't hiding any information from the people that maintain the list?

I'd like to believe its all ok. But I think false information that I am safe is worse than knowing I'm doomed.

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Post ID: @5rub+RDJx64X

Regarding Oracle office closures -- if you do a bit of digging on the global IT website in reference to the office wifi upgrades going on, you can find a list of every Oracle office in the world and that list tells you if the office is closing, expanding, shrinking, being retained as is, or a new facility, among other things.

Relatively speaking, there are not that many offices slated for closure, according to that list.

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Post ID: @5rzq+RDJx64X

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