Thread regarding Oracle Corp. layoffs

My Review of Oracle Cloud

I would like to share with you my thoughts on Oracle Cloud as someone who has worked for a partner/customer for many years. I just am so frustrated by using their cloud I need to vent somewhere! That being said, I know that my living at the moment is funded indirectly by Oracle so have to be somewhat careful.

  1. Buggy - When we have tried different could services, including SaaS, PaaS and IaaS services, we have found them to be very buggy - even in provisioning. At times, simple data entry screens take minutes to load. It is clear that the technology used to build their cloud is very outdated - particularly the user interface. We regularly have times where our services are unavailable - mainly PaaS and IaaS and we get error messages (e.g. 500 service not available) and we raise a ticket with Oracle. Eventually, it comes back working, but they NEVER can tell us what the problem was, and the dashboard showing service availability shows green all the time (i.e they do not record the outage). It feels like the software has been rushed out half-finished. It also seems like the consistency between products is non-existant - very much like separate companies have made the products.
  1. DR is all over the place - there is no consistency. Some services have no DR at all and you cannot do anything about it, others you are responsible for maintaining a DR and it is rudimentary to say the least and I would say next to impossible to reliably operate a DR solution yourself. Oracle will suggest the most bizarre and unacceptable workarounds for this issue. The only area which seems to have some type of build in DR are the SaaS services. However, even with these, you cannot test them, and Oracle gives no assurance or guarantees about anything. Given the state of the rest of their cloud, I would not trust it one bit. If you have multiple services which all need to operate together in the event of a DR event, then you better go and buy a lottery ticket as it is next to impossible to do this with Oracle cloud.
  1. Outage windows - good luck keeping your systems up all the time! Each service can have different outage/maintenance windows. This means that if your system uses a handful of cloud services (e.g. a mix of SaaS, PaaS, IaaS) you will be having outage most weekends! I counted the outage windows on our services last year and 60% of weekends we had maintenance windows for the year for one of our products. Regularly the window would be lengthy - i.e 12 hours plus and also often run over time. They are all on the weekend so if you run your business 5 days per week it might be ok, but if you want your solution up 24x7 you are in big trouble. They will never mention this to you when buying of course - it will be buried in legal documents no-one ever can understand or read.
  1. Performance - With the SaaS products (at least the 6-8 I have tried out), they are excruciatingly slow - to a level that it is embarrassing. Oracle in their demos always blame the internet connection and pretend that something seems wrong unexpectedly or say it's just a demo system and the real one is way faster. Let me tell you, they are so slow all the time your users will be mortified. It is like watching paint dry - even for production systems. I don't have enough data to comment on PaaS/IaaS but clearly the SaaS stuff has so much inefficiency when they built it I am not sure what they can do apart from a rewrite.
  1. Integration - Oracle suggests all the time in their flashy powerpoints that their cloud products are all integrated together. Nothing is further from the truth. Go take a look at the integration documentation on their SaaS products for yourself. For a start, each product could have a different way of integrating. Most of the SaaS products have very limited integration capability using modern patterns/techniques. In fact, you mostly have to batch up data in files and then run a loading job and wait for it to finish or request a file extraction to get any basic data (e..g mainly file-based integration rather than real-time web services a modern system would have). This is decades old. This has lots of impacts including not being able to do lots of things in real-time. In addition to this flaw, lots of functions are simply not available to integrate with, so there is nothing you can do even if you want to. You might need to resort to creating software to mimic a user typing stuff into a screen - I am not kidding!
  1. Reliability - When showing our users any of the systems in a demo/showcase type of session, it would be so nervewracking because the solutions often have bugs/ things don't work etc That's the level of confidence you have after using the software a long time. Nerves that it actually works normally.
  1. Pricing - Oracle have changed pricing structures over the years and it is still very difficult to figure out even if you have been working with them for a long time. It would seem a lot of users sign up to complex deals thinking they get something only to learn that their "credits" have run out and they have to pay more. The SaaS pricing is generally straight forward (by user), but try and figure out PaaS and you are in trouble. Lots of services have dependent services you need to buy and no-one at Orale can tell you how much you might need of each one or what impact buying more/less capacity might have (if it is CPU bound). Even experienced Oracle sales people find it very difficult to price a solution involving SaaS and PaaS/IaaS. The software is very expensive for what you get compared with other vendors. Prepare to burn money big time. You get locked into buying credits which you either don't use or use more and have to pay more.

8 Support - Creating a ticket with support pretty for most of the things above is like extracting blood out of a stone. The support is very slow, seem to have no clue at all about how anything works and rarely resolve anything. Every bug you find is actually a "feature". Even instances where the software on the screen says "Click here to do XYZ" and instead it does "ABC" they tell you it is working as designed. You will pull out your hair.

  1. Promises Promises - When Oracle try and sell the products to you, I must say the powerpoints are very flash and they really hone in on the buyer (who is generally a non techy who gets wowed by the presentations). According to the powerpoints, this software is like a Ferrari, when in reality it is like a bicycle cobbled together with bits of rusty rubbish.

10 Upgrading - HaHa! When the next version of the service (e.g. a PaaS product ) comes out after your system has been going for a year, it's often a migration exercise to the newer version as Oracle have not figured out how to upgrade an existing service. Often it will be incompatible with what you have already created. The version you are on then gets no more upgrades as they are working on the new version. So really, there is a constant upgrade battle going on. Sometimes you are forced to upgrade.

  1. Cornered - The only reason lots of people buy the Oracle cloud is they are legally cornered from their existing licensing conditions. They have likely have had an audit and been forced to buy cloud credits.

I could go on and on, but this is enough for now.

Even though I have so many negatives here, I do want to also mention the positives.

  1. In general, the Oracle pre-sales team you deal with do their best to help you out (in my experience anyway) and are fairly switched on
  2. Some of their SaaS software does have functionality you can't really get from other vendors
  3. The vision of having SaaS/PaaS/IaaS all working together is a very noble one and does resonate with enterprises (the vision is simply not being anywhere near met - 5% reached in my view)
  4. If you had a very Oracle DB intense workload, the Exadata in the cloud does seem a reasonable proposition
  5. Very occasionally I have seen some customers getting a massive discount so they can get a reference customer.

Overall however, if you had read the above you can see what a poor position Oracle is in and how much catchup they need to remain even remotely competitive. If I were a prospective customer I would be very very worried!

Rant over! ( and I feel better for it). Please ask any questions you like.

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| 11269 views | | 59 replies (last ) | Reply
Post ID: @OP+10kWw3yM

59 replies (most recent on top)

I always use the "Wifi must be bad" connection and pretend there must be something wrong with it.... "That hasn't happened before". I just cannot believe people buy this rubbish. It is like lambs to the slaughter.

The part I must agree most with the OP is with the bugs. You wonder who ever approved the releases. They will have to take the embarrassment to their grave!

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Post ID: @Alms+10kWw3yM

Love this post also. This is pretty much exactly spot on. I would say it is even worse than the OP made out. Good luck if you have to use it! lol

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Post ID: @Aden+10kWw3yM

I LOVE this post. Shows you the results of all the dysfunction that exists in engineering.

Oracle is a sh–ty company.

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Post ID: @zvop+10kWw3yM

SaaS is totally boned as well. Why do you think our overall apps rev has been flat for so long. It was a growing business before we put all out eggs into the FA basket. Now, the best we can hope for is to continue treading water in that market. FA k–led our growth for good.

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Post ID: @nqfv+10kWw3yM

Agreed that SaaS is the only thing that a company might want to buy... everything else is a disaster!

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Post ID: @ngiz+10kWw3yM

A friend of mine is trying to integrate with Oracle ERP Cloud at his company and he says it is woeful. He said it is the worst product he has ever tried to integrate with. It simply does not work and no-one from Oracle can figure it out either. Good luck!

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Post ID: @htvs+10kWw3yM

And what exactly are the going to do if you refuse to pay the fines? They can sue you or they can let it go. They let it go because the don’t want to be counter sued for fraud

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Post ID: @gxqn+10kWw3yM

They dont sue you, they fine you. Just ask CTL.

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Post ID: @gpbc+10kWw3yM

@gqda - just cancel your licenses and get something else. Oracle talks a tough game but when push comes to shove they won’t sue you, in fact oracle has never sued a customer — too afraid that too much garbage and outright fraud would come out into the public domain. If you stand your ground, they’ll just slink off with the tail between their legs. Good luck to you !

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Post ID: @gndk+10kWw3yM

The biz I work for is a customer and I have just stumbled upon this site and thread... now everything makes sense! I was getting worried my team implementing the cloud were just not up to scratch (even though they have been top performers for 5+ years). Now I know our business buyers have been conned! I told them to watch out! After showing this thread to my team, they concur 100%

doh

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Post ID: @gqda+10kWw3yM

People don’t buy oracle cloud to actually use it, plus oracle doesn’t have the capacity to let them. Companies buy oracle cloud as an offset to their on-prem licensing fees: customer gets a lower overall price and oracle can claim cloud revenues and Therefore a higher share price. We don’t call this cloud fraud for nothing, it really is fraudulent

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Post ID: @6qod+10kWw3yM

Based on my experience I pretty much agree with everything the OP said. I also wish I could upvote it a million times as someone else said!

The products are just so poor I cannot believe anyone would actually want to buy them if they only knew!

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Post ID: @5yrj+10kWw3yM

The Cloud HCM and Expense Systems do not even work for the employees within Oracle, it is one step backward from EBS. Oracle SaaS is a pure joke, PaaS is BS, IaaS does not exist; only foolish customers who have a very weak Technology exposure or some false information provided during the Sales Cycle dupes the customer into purchasing these inefficient, incomplete, illogical products.

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Post ID: @rtg+10kWw3yM

Ex-Oracle also here. All people that were there know that most of the revenue was pushed into deals and not used.

You do not need great products for that. Just greed and dishonesty.

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Post ID: @tex+10kWw3yM

I really don't understand why people continue to buy Oracle products and why Oracle is still a going concern. Just a casual google search digs up multitudes of horror stories and what a slimy company Oracle is when it comes to properly treating its customers (and employees). If you buy Oracle you deserve what you get.

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Post ID: @iss+10kWw3yM

“Even with the Sun hardware, there’s no lab for the field tech to experiment with.”

This. We had to fight for the virtual machine lab we had when doing Solaris support. It worked fairly well for one offs to test customer scenarios. A lack of a test environment should tell you all you need to know about the quality of oracle’s offering.

I feel for the support reps who have to field those SRs, and can understand why they would use MOS to hide from their customers. MOS allows you to do that very well, since it allows you to ignore calls, and get the customer to insist on xfr to another rep.

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Post ID: @ojq+10kWw3yM

I was a Sales Consultant for PaaS and IaaS and I can confirm all these points. I have myself blamed the wifi more than once, even though it was just as slow back in the office.

Integration between these products is incidental, as each product team only cares for their own stuff, and doesn't think they need anyone else. And you can't really blame them, because I've personally seen products fail because they've invested heavily on an integration, only to find out the other product team never really cared much for it, and decided to take their own product in a different direction. Suddenly the PMs were left with a huge gap in their portfolio, and no way to fix it quickly.

What infuriated me the most was the fact that once LE decided cloud was the way to go, Product teams were pushing buggy, unfinished cloud products that lacked basic features (and I do mean BASIC) to the field, thinking customers would naturally prefer to use the cloud version, because well, it's cloud. And the sales teams were ordered to sell 'cloud first', regardless of what the customer actually needs. It was frustrating trying to 'work-around' very stupid limitations, while being told I couldn't sell the on-prem version, which would deliver much more value.

I ultimately left Oracle because I realized we were selling cloud products to solve our own problems, not our customers'...

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Post ID: @vje+10kWw3yM

I only wish I could upvote this 1 MILLION times. Especially #11. It’s my opinion that these “audits” are a mechanism for near on extortion. What a way to get customers to buy cloud.. FORCE them or make them pay penalties that are higher than the sale. It’s all sickening.

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Post ID: @qct+10kWw3yM

ex-Oracle here, Oracle invests in lip service. Even with the Sun hardware, there’s no lab for the field tech to experiment with. The customers’ equipment is the lab. I guess it’s the same for Software then. To be honest, Oracle has metrics and it’s funny how people can be creative with them. There’s no value created for anyone but management.

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Post ID: @osx+10kWw3yM

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