With rumors of Dividend cuts on Wall Street and the current events of the last few weeks how long can this economy sustain viable long term operations.
How long before they go to some sort of voluntary reduction.
36 replies (most recent on top)
Get your top heads out of your rear. It is 2020. Not 2008,2009,2017,2018, or 2019. One month ago your 401 was worth, over a million for 30 plus salaried, today, do not look. Your PRP now stands for Personnel Reduction Program. Wake up.
Your PRP is being let go. 6 months pay and healthcare. Do not ask the Gov. for money. Remember you are fine where you are according to Opie of Mayberry. Maybe Elena can sell her ship to help the company out. You waved the flag 11 years ago at GM and Chrysler, now it is you waving the white flag.
Ford will go begging the government for money, once they get it they will
give out bonuses to the c-suite,
buy back Ford stock to prop up the stock price so the c-suite can sell their stock,
then they will have mass staff reductions,
followed by again giving out bonuses to the c-suite for saving Ford money,
followed by c-suite selling off more of their stock
Everyone should remember that the c-suite does not concern themselves
with trivialities such as truth and ethics. Those trivialities only apply to the working class.
Anyone who hasn’t realized this yet has not been paying attention.
okay - sure.
Ford will use the pandemic as a reason to quickly shed people and satisfy shareholders.
I agree with some others, they do not have the luxury of coming up with offers and waiting for people to accept them, and then keep them around for another 6 months on the country club PRP.
This may be the darkest time in Ford history - finally doing what is required to stay in business. Perhaps 15% headcount reduction by firing, 3 months severance, bye bye have a nice life.
PRP dreamers better wake up now!
Just be patient. Offers will be made. For those who want out with a kicker bide your time.
Agree with @4wnr+13ZqHoEu - end of 2nd qtr/beginning of 3rd qtr would be the time to offer packages, as the market & analysts would almost expect it, and in a weird way might actual move the needle up on stock price
If there was ever a better scenario to bury special charges for separations & packages, it would be in the coming 2Q 2020 results.
Fired............ nah they got a whole lot of divi payments they aren't going to pay. Plenty to go around for offers.
Here is your PRP. You are fired. Take your six months pay. No. We are not family.
No unfortunately shareholder value is not job one. The board could not stand and watch this slow steady deliberate Iceberg disaster for 3 years and claim shareholder value is the goal.
Someone mentioned if the Corona virus is indeed sweeping through the White House PRP/Offers will be the last you need to worry about and more like the place you have in a soup line.
Really folks this is really serious.
The way I understand it if the stock stays below $0.99/share for 30 consecutive days the family looses voting rights.
If that is tru there will be some sort of change coming.
The bird sang this morning and flew off the nest. Once in the air, the bird realized it was just dropping and dropping. Before hitting the bottom, she realized that she had wings. Yet, the weight she had on her back was just too much for her wings. But before hitting the ground, she off loaded the big weight and she just took off into the sky like she had never done it before.
Airlines, Boeing, autos will look for help from Federal government. I don't expect CEO raises, bonuses, or packages in the next 9 months.
I think Ford will need help as residual values for vehicles coming off lease will be lower than expected. Default s on loans will be high. If Ford does look for help I wouldn't expect packages until 2021 or 2022
No way they are not going to at least make some sort of offer in the current events. They have nothing to loose.
Not saying there are going to reductions however reduction through involuntary means would be bad optics as in Bigly bad optics.
Statistics and facts say that stockholders don't give a darn about your personal sacrifice. At this point it's about shareholder value. Your most recent post points to the reason Ford workers feel entitled.
There really is no need to get nasty or negative on PRP discussion. I would fall in a group that's been here well over 30 years and believe it or not, have given a huge amount f energy and sacrifice to this company. To watch the juicy offers over the last several years given to people that by all accounts, don't need it, does make you think Ford should offer something now for going through the last three years of nonsense. No one's going to retire willingly with your 401k falling in the basement so if they want people and their experience pushed out the door, they can offer somethung. It's not entitlenent, it would definitely be an extra benefit.
Here's your offer..there is the door, if you want to leave, great, don't let it hit you...why in the heck do you feel the owe you anything you misguided fools..
They made a nice juicy offer in mid 17' just as Fields was on his way out. The offer was in June. However they excluded PD :(.
They started a PRP in March of 18' then quickly super sized it with an enhancement.
As someone else eluded to earlier the enhanced part of it amounted to the same severance an employee would receive at that age. 55 minimum with 10 yrs or more tenure. In essence they didn't give much away, just made it sound like the employees were choosing.
There were 2 phases of the enhanced in 18' The next 2 phases payed out in 19' and weren't so enhanced :(
If my records are right in 2017 they offered PRP starting end of January, in 2018 PRP offers started end of March. So there is some more time to go before they may do what's typical , in 2020. With the worldwide virus they may just wait 60 days longer to do anything, but it does seem like they're just making work conditions miserable to encourage people that just go.
Not correct - the company allocated 11 billion for the transformation; that did not include the 30+ plus billion they keep in reserve for contingencies, such as recessions. We had between 40 to 44 billion a year ago, so I don't see much danger/risk yet - but the key word is yet.
Yes of course, things can always change, YMMV, bla, bla,bla. IMO it t would be risky to do more blood letting now when the transformation is not even half done, unless they also scale back the transformation plans, as well.
I can sense they are already doing that with the new campus/building plans, which were very grandiose at one time; now, I think it will amount to a new PDC and WHQ building and call it a day. This grand experiment of most people working remote, if successful, will ,likely change how most of us work in the near and long term future if I am correct, that allow could save 5 + billion dollars.
They have not said the PRP will not be available for 2020. Usually by now they would have indicated one way or another.
IMO they are considering all options.
There are ways to encourage employees to leave voluntarily ....
It is a different world than 2008-2009. The cash is to cushion the dramatic transformation Ford is making over the next five years. If costs exceed revenue for a few weeks then I don't expect a PRP
I was around in 2007/2008/2009 - and it was different:
- Voluntary packages were offered, as many have mentioned. Moreover, at the time you had that talk with your L6 or L5, they told you point blank this offer might be the best you get, and no promises if you refuses....and that is exactly what happened
- In the 2007/2008 time frame, at that point Ford had already been losing money for nearly 4 years, so they had far less money in the back. If I recall, by 2008 they had about 15 billion in the bank. Today, as of 2 weeks ago I think they have something like 34-35 billion in the bank. We are much better position to ride this out then in 2007/2008.
It is true, there is no telling what current management team will do; however, I still believe they would go the PRP route first, as I can't recall in 21 years they have followed up a year of involuntary layoffs with another round the following year. If they did, it would be a first, and also make it very difficult to bring in new talent.
WE all just need to stay calm, do our jobs, and not worry so much - there is always time to worry later.... Just my two cents'
Can't tap you on the shoulder if you are working from home.
Yes the economy will come back, but will Ford? They are still wallowing around as they have been for years before the virus hit.
Watch for a dividend cut soon, and stock dropping below a buck.
@1mum - xactly there was an offer made - albeit all the while the F150 badge was sitting on the desk of some bank CEO as collateral if indeed F failed. And that is xactly what I am talking about now.
Those who did not take the offer and let go ran the gammit and were given severance.
I saw both choices play out. Some took the offer - voluntary and it was generous and saw some decline it. Unfortunately for some they wound up with less - involuntary.
Arguably that was the worst economic time most if not all of us have ever seen or will ever see. This time it's different. Think the Nintendo stock craze or Bitcoin stock craze, hysteria it's all the same.
Cept in this case when the dust settles and the dust will settle the economy will come roaring back.
Doubt Ford will continue to pay employees to leave in current environment
@1mum; your missing the point. My department was hit with four waves of layoffs that was not voluntary. Lost 38% of the group. Although early on packages may have been available, very few people took them. I personally had several good friends tapped on the shoulder and left the building doing the “walk of shame” with two boxes in hand. You take your chances if a package is offered, and you don’t bite. With the current leadership, all bets are off.
@1mum+13ZqHoEu Not true
If you were there in 08/09 you would know they were offering 1 years pay to voluntarily leave the company. Virtually everyone was offered this from a meeting with their supervisor/manager.
After that if you did not take the offer and were shoulder tapped severance and HC benis were provided.
It’s more reasonable to expect involuntary layoffs like in the 2007 time frame. Multiple rounds of walking people out the door. The company and world situation is in worse shape now. Jimmy Boy has all of 2020 to burn the company to the ground.
[[@per+13ZqHoEu]] Respectfully dis - agree. Enhanced PRPs for 55+ 10 yr minimum employees are the Tri - fecta for the bean counters. Gets big salaries off the books and in most cases no more contributing to legacy costs due to increasing pension benefits, and potentially high need HC costs off the books lightning fast.
If it is enhanced it's the same as severance without the psychological part of involuntary layoffs.
You need to stop these PRP fantasies. The world has changed since 2018, when they were last offered.
Ford can not afford to have folks on PRP working half-time at full pay (which most Ford employees currently practice) for 6 months. It is bad enough with everyone working at home now. Nothing will get done, programs will be delayed/cancelled.
If they have to cut dividends, stock will quickly head to zero. There is no reason to own it - perhaps you can get stock certificates to use at toilet paper.
Corona is not going away quickly - the economy impacts have not even been felt yet as things are finally shutting down now. Second/Third quarter results will be horrible - prompting the dividend cut and resulting in firings with minimal severance.
I hate to be so negative, but the automotive sector is not the place to be in a recession.
Stay healthy folks.
PRPs are more than likely still on the table as there has been no official word of them not being offered for this year. I would say if there is no official word on them not being offered by April 1st they will probably make PRP offers or some sort of offer is in works.