Thread regarding Cisco Systems Inc. layoffs

There is also a portion that the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission says gives the right to an employer to deny a religious exemption for what's called "undue hardship." That's defined as "more than a de minimis" or minimal burden or cost to run an employer's business. It could lead to an employee getting fired.

And then we have this from last Friday
The Supreme Court on Friday denied an emergency request by healthcare workers in Maine for a religious exemption from the state’s requirement that they be vaccinated against Covid-19.

You can scream at Cisco but it is just following the law.

"but it is proven that you have taken other medications that use stem cells in testing. Then you are obviously not sincere."

False. That would require that you KNEW that other medications used stem cells in testing.

"Sincere religious and spiritual belief can only be determined by the believer. There is no lie detector test for sincerity."

If you claim to not take want covid vaccine because of stem cells in testing, but it is proven that you have taken other medications that use stem cells in testing. Then you are obviously not sincere.

Sincere religious and spiritual belief can only be determined by the believer. There is no lie detector test for sincerity. Therefore - any request for spiritual or religious exemption should be allowed - or Cisco is looking at a massive lawsuit. I say - accept all requests for religious exemptions and let God sort out the sincerity.

https://katv.com/news/local/conway-regional-ceo-says-covid-19-religious-exemption-isnt-an-attempt-to-shame-employees

Who is making the determination that people have sincere religious beliefs? If I tell them I am a Jehovah's Witness, do they ask for 2 references? I didn't do anything on Halloween, so who is to say I am not?

"If you have a religious belief that prevents you from taking the shot and you get fired, you could sue and you might win. You have rights."

Reasonable accommodations will be provided to accommodate sincerely-held religious beliefs unless they would pose an undue hardship. The employer is under no legal responsibility to provide you the same job should you be granted a religious exemption. The burden of proof is on the employee in this case. My guess is that Cisco has outsourced this for these reasons.

"you can be let go for any reason at any time"
False. Those with a religious reason for accommodation are entitled to one under Title VII of the Civil Rights Act. Look it up. It has nothing to do with right-to-work.

Medical exemptions may or may not be covered under existing law, I haven't researched it.

If you have a religious belief that prevents you from taking the shot and you get fired, you could sue and you might win. You have rights.

NBC is vapid and silly propaganda - has been for years.

https://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/federal-contractors-get-broad-flexibility-enforce-covid-vaccine-rules-rcna4240

Federal contractors will have broad leeway to enforce President Joe Biden’s Covid-19 vaccine mandate, according to new guidance the White House released on Monday, laying out details on implementation of the rules.

Under the new guidance, federal contractors from IBM and Boeing to food service providers will have flexibility to determine how they enforce the vaccination requirements for workers who refuse to be vaccinated.

“A covered contractor should determine the appropriate means of enforcement with respect to its employee at a covered contractor workplace who refuses to be vaccinated and has not been provided, or does not have a pending request for, an accommodation,” said the guidelines, which affect millions of workers.

Yes, get on with your lawyers and hear them saying that Cisco is a right-to-work company which means you can be let go for any reason at any time.

Watch a greedy lawyer get your money and your baseless lawsuit being thrown out of the courts for lack of merit.

Get mesmerized when you find out that you will be jobless for a long time since most companies in the industry are requiring the vaccines.

Don't like that? Well, that's capitalism. Too bad it isn't working for you.

If anyone is contacting their lawyer and getting the lawsuits started - can those of us that are on this thread please connect up with you and be included in the suit? Would love to have a good solid group together for this lawsuit. So many avenues to approach it from - especially since most of us are remote with no customer contact and no federal contracts.

Eh, Cisco has been sh---y to it's employees for a long time - this is just the last in a long line of terrible things it feels it's entitled to do.

To anyone losing your job over this: You're a hero, and I'm glad you are here. We are fighting a fight for freedom and decency in this world. We're not losing anything that was worth keeping.

And because we are fighters - we will land on our feet. 3 months to find a new gig? We can do that. Let's go support and run the companies that have their heads on straight and let this one burn in it's own dumpster fire it's creating.

Abide by the rules

https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/01/politics/vaccine-rules-osha/index.html

I work for a company with a similar mandate, but it soon will not matter. The OSHA compliance rules will be announced in the near future.

If you want to stay unvaccinated without a valid religious or medical exemption, you are going to have to find a company less than 100 employees to work for; one not subject to federal contractor or the OSHA rules. And even then, many of those smaller companies may choose to make vaccination a condition of employment.

You can't offer a severance package to those that decline the vaccine without offering the same package to those that took the vaccine. I have to believe the +90% number is correct. If you look at California(which has the most Cisco employees) 73% are fully vaccinated BUT 89% have had at least one dose. (only looking at those above 18 years of age). Other companies with mandates are getting in the 96-97% compliance range, no reason to expect Cisco to be different. At 97% that would be around 2,000 looking for work. I also believe that unemployment benefits will not be awarded as well.

The obvious issue with offering the usual severance package is the stampede of people rushing to take it. On the other hand, they could offer it with the requirement that you properly hand off your work and be available for questions.

Why doesn't Cisco do the right thing now if they are so concerned about the safety and wellbeing of their employees? Why not a 6 months severance pay or offer another early retirement option? SIGN ME UP! Honest answer... we all know why :) Its easier this way to do the layoffs we all knew were coming and not "cost Cisco a dime."

What would you do if Cisco said you have to make sure your immediate family need to be vaccinated, including your children? Where’s the line here?

If they can mandate that you put a substance into your body, any substance, where does it end?

I almost died from the first shot. Please don't make me take the second one.

"We've all known this day was coming for months. Get vaccinated, or don't. Find another job or get fired, the choices are yours. Good luck finding another job with any large, especially global company that's not requiring vaccinations.

Call me a sheep if you want, but I served my country and earned my veteran status. I was told what I could and couldn't do, told where to go, how to dress and groom, what vaccinations I had to have, etc. I was even denied some of my First Amendment rights of free speech under the UCMJ."

First off, thank you for your service and I do disagree with name calling like telling people they are sheep for making a choice that they believe is in their best interest. I am grateful to those that choose to serve the country. That said, you knew what the agreement was when you chose to serve I believe. There is a difference here, since last I checked none of us agreed to vaccinations especially ones under EUA to be mandated to take or lose your employment at Cisco. Secondly, as far as your statement "we knew this was coming"? I find that interesting that you have been able to already memory ho-e that earlier this year Biden (Dec.) & Jen Psaki (July) said there would not be a vaccine mandate.

Finally, there are individuals who should be protected by the ADA due to medical conditions beyond their control who will be cast aside in this process since Cisco will preside over whether you get to keep your job and measure you worth to the company. This may happen regardless if you & your Dr. have agreed that this vaccination may cause harm in your particular health situation. Maybe you are okay with this and my guess if you are you've never dealt with a serious life threatening health issue in your life.

Regarding the 90% of Cisco's employees vaccinated numbers being way off, many of their employees are in demographics with low vaccination rates (for good and understandable reasons). I am concerned that even though Cisco says that they want to be inclusive, these demographics will be hurt along with everyone else.

They keep using the 90% number as that is the magic "everyone has already done it, so you should too" number. There is absolutely no way they have any kind of reliable guess at the number as most people just haven't bothered uploading anything yet. However, they could likely estimate it based on country wide stats adjusted for education level and the racial makeup of the company.

The first step of the accommodation process is to submit the smartsheet form. That satisfies the Nov 5 requirement. Second step is employee relations reaches out to the employee.

Please share your experience with employee relations if and when they contact you.

Cisco was already having a hard time working thru how the salesforce was going to interact with customers that require vaccination for in person interaction. Huge companies such as WalMart, Google, almost the entire financial customer base are requiring this. How do have account teams that can't actually meet with customers.

Internal Cisco surveys showed that 90% of employees are vaccinated. Cisco is scrambling because they now know that is grossly inaccurate. And now many vaccinated employees are not entering their status into workday because they feel that Cisco's mandate is wrong.

How can anyone at Cisco say with a straight face that they are "building an inclusive future for all"

Do not understand why this must apply to US based, remote contractors who are never expected to be onsite.

The good thing is that we should expect work force re-aligment... I will assume that non-vaccinated workers based overseas will be removed from the teams supporting the federal contracts as they will not meet the vax requirement? hahahaha, that was a good joke.

I shared a concern I had. It was not political. It was not insulting. It was removed. Moderators... be fair.

Get vaxxed or get shafted.

If you are vaccinated and wish to quietly protest this, just wait until the last day to input your information into Workday. If you like your boss, you can just verbally tell him. Make them sweat over the stats a little bit.

Like many things in life, I believe this will work out the way it should for all concerned.

I will make it my life's mission to see the execs prosecuted for following this illegal mandate.

Everyone here is so sure they’re right. What if you’re not? Stop feeding your confirmation bias and keep an open mind. Question assumptions, and hold yourselves and your leaders accountable.

Guess I'm not in the cool club anymore.

This thread is akin to a high-school popularity contest.

" into at will employment."

You should do some research on ADA, EEOC, HIPAA, and vast numbers of other laws, regulations and the Constitution that make this illegal. Current admin is temporary. People's memories aren't.

LOLZ.

You anti-vaxxers should do some "research" into at will employment.

Go and fight back. Do you think that Cisco, IBM, Microsoft, and all the other companies who implemented this policy didn't do their homework? Their lawyers know what they are doing.

Start your lawsuits and see how well this will work for you. Oh, and the Supreme Court is already showing they will not back you up on this.

Poor little toddlers... so entitled and used to getting away with everything, shocked their tantrums are going nowhere this time. Truly hilarious.

"Question is if I go religious exemption will I get discriminated against and get fired anyways."

I have thought the same thing. It doesn't seem that Cisco respects an individual's personal religious beliefs. My manager is encouraging me to get a medical exemption as I would likely qualify, but even that seems really intrusive that Cisco will determine what is best for my health, not myself or my Dr's. At this point, I may not submit anything. I could use a break from this place and probably a fresh start. I am lucky to have the means to do so as I know others are not as fortunate.

Texas sues feds. Expect companies like Cisco to be on the receiving end of HUGE class action lawsuits. I am not anti-vax, but natural immunity MUST be recognized. This is not about health, but control and oppression. Now, Cisco feels safe. But administrations change. There will be a response.

https://www.texastribune.org/2021/10/29/texas-covid-19-vaccine-mandates-lawsuit/