Just saw on LinkedIn another VP leaving, no update where she is going. Aside from senior leadership, major uptick of key technical talent and business types saying goodbye. I left about a year ago and enjoyed that others where leaving (helped me confirm I did the right thing), but now I'm over that and starting to feel sad that Cisco is on bad trajectory... I had really great experiences/memories as a delivery engineer for 8 years, sucks to think other engineers won't have the same experiences
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"I'm in it purely for the retiree medical access plan to provide me healthcare until I'm eligible for Medicare/Medicaid."
You do realize that you have to pay full price for the retiree medical plan, right? Cisco contributes ZERO for retirees....it even states that clearly in the retiree plan brochure. For states other than Georgia or California, the retiree plans are barely better (and in some cases worse) than ACA/Obamacare. Retirees in Georgia and CA get access to some low cost HMO plans, but everyone else does not. It's messed up.
"I certainly wish America had reached a post-racial society but no one with a brain and who has been aware the last few years can honestly believe we are there yet."
Oh but it's so much worse than that. A large chunk of America actually does not want such a society. Bigotry, demagoguery and idiocy are easier options.
“ If you find this slogan racist, it says everything we need to know about you rather than me.”
Yes, it says that I’ve seen case after case of racism by many police with huge differences in how black citizens are treated and realize that there’s still a large chunk of Americans - including those with gyms who are supposed to protect us - who don’t value black lives as equal to whites and, therefore, this problem needs to have a spotlight on it. I certainly wish America had reached a post-racial society but no one with a brain and who has been aware the last few years can honestly believe we are there yet.
"It destroys a group from the inside to not allow people to speak their minds."
How about that speak their minds elsewhere than in the check-in chat? You actually enjoy reading 1000 "hello from " and "Fran how do you always look so young"? Amazing.
"Hired on to TAC in 2000 as Grade 9 at $101,000. Left 15 years later Grade 10 at $178,000 plus bonus." That number at best was WITH the bonus and some stock being cashed in. Even in ca and ny. Anyone claiming more is full of it. That much I am 100% sure of.
“all lives matter” as a phrase isn’t racist, but as a slogan it absolutely is.
As a slogan it says something that was 100% accepted cultural wisdom only 5 years ago. We need to move past race - most especially using it as a label to divide us. The keen desire of just about all liberal minded folk until almost yesterday that we needed a post-racial world.
In the last 2-3 years, stating this view will get you branded a racist, and creates a mob trying to cancel you. If you find this slogan racist, it says everything we need to know about you rather than me.
Real leaders don't need to use censorship or mandates.
Those are the tools of tyrants.
Censoring people is never the answer.
If you censor people - they just say what they want but behind your back. It destroys a group from the inside to not allow people to speak their minds.
If you don't like the chat - just stop reading it. Many of us love the chat.
"And just as a side note: Firing someone for saying "all lives matter" on a chat was ridiculous"
No. What's ridiculous is the sheer amount of imbeciles feeling absolutely entitled to broadcast their opinions to a majority that couldn't give a rat's b-m about it. Every check-in unfolds the same way. Someone can't resist the urge to compliment Fran's amazing hairdo, or tell the world how Ivermectin helps with COVID. That chat need to be turned off for the benefit of everyone.
'“all lives matter” as a phrase isn’t racist, but as a slogan it absolutely is. Don’t pretend it’s not a political (and racist) reaction to the slogan “black lives matter”.'
A lot of people (racists apparently according to you and others) would deem "all lives matter' which includes all races as a logical conclusion to BLM.
"All lives matter" isn't racist as a slogan or otherwise. It's inclusive of everyone. It is the opposite of racist in any context.
Just as "Black lives matter" isn't racist. It is a statement that black lives matter. "All lives matter" isn't racist - it's a statement that all lives matter. As a slogan it includes the many races of people that are ki---d by police officers, as well as the police officers themselves who have to defend themselves in sometimes questionable situations.
Black lives - are included in "All lives matter". It's not trying to take anything away from the black lives matter movement. Rather - "All lives matter" is trying to help unify the people of this country and minimize the race politics that are fueling the remaining racism in this country.
If people would unite and stand together against injustice in all forms - we would have a much higher chance of making thoughtful changes.
And "all lives matter" because not just black people are being ki---d by police each year: https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/ Everyone needs to stand together to solve an obvious problem. Including the police officers who are struggling to feel safe enough that they don't pull their g-ns out in interactions.
@1epu+1f7jmG80 - and it's all under the guise of ellite techncial "leadership" - pumping money into spurious social causes and associated diversions from core business development. Then it is all tidyed up with a a nice "We Care" bow. The reality is they are pocketing YOUR money by these tactics. Why don't people see it?????
"How times have changed.
What is wrong with this picture????"
The objective of corporate America is to outsource full-time jobs to countries without labor laws... OR have Americans work as temp workers without health/retirement benefits.
@1uzj+1f7jmG80 “all lives matter” as a phrase isn’t racist, but as a slogan it absolutely is. Don’t pretend it’s not a political (and racist) reaction to the slogan “black lives matter”.
@1ocd+1f7jmG804
The point is they get what they pay for.
Pay well - get prime responsive TAC service.
Pay $60K - for TAC. Do you want to be on call and take after hours calls and texts for $60K?
Earned every penny I made at Cisco. Did a few almost 24 hour escalation calls. By choice.
People aren't going to commit to that lifestyle if the pay isn't +$150K at least, plus stock options, plus bonus. You live the job 7x24. Old school TAC people can relate.
Hired on to TAC in 2000 as Grade 9 at $101,000. Left 15 years later Grade 10 at $178,000 plus bonus.
LR'd due to being senior I guess, plus over 50. Had a new job in three days.
How times have changed.
What is wrong with this picture????
The forced silence isn't just divisive comments or racist ones.
Any time a person says anything thier manager doesn't absolutely love - that person ends up on the next LR list. Everyone has learned to keep thier opinions to themselves. All opinions.
So the needed opinions - like "this project isn't going to work" or "that is going to be really expensive in the long run and we probably shouldn't do it" or "we shouldn't be firing everyone every six months, it ki--s moral" are not spoken out loud. And problems just fester.
(And just as a side note: Firing someone for saying "all lives matter" on a chat was ridiculous. That comment is the opposite of racist and shouldn't have gotten anyone fired. All lives means everyone matters no matter thier skin color - the most inclusive you could be).
MM was asking people "Do you know who I am?!" And making them fear for thier jobs just because they didn't memorize her face.
The culture here is broken.
Tons of people at Cisco aren't making large incomes. Many no where near 100k. Consider the TAC tier 1 staff, contractor PMs, data input, and the many many early-in-career staff.
Many are making under 60k.
Most of the well paid jobs are also being moved over seas or to vendors where we can pay 1/2 the price.
So we have both sets of people struggling. People at the 100k mark that can't make the expensive tech hub rent. People in lower cost areas that can't afford food.
The ELT hasn't addressed this and needs to.
We have asked about increases in multiple checkins and the leadership shrugs it off like its annoying.
To them, it is annoying. The cost of inflation doesn't impact them at all. What's the impact of spending a couple of extra thousand on groceries or dining out when you make millions?
People don't have enough money to pay the bills. No one I know would be working two jobs if they didn't have to to make ends meet.
Most people at Cisco are making $100K or more. Quite a bit more if you believe all the posts here. If you can't "pay the bills" w/ $100K income, how do you think people working in retail or food service industries feel? Most of them would stop working two jobs to make $60K, if that much, just to have one job that makes $100K.
@1avt+1f7jmG80 Cisco hasn’t had strong products for over 15 years. The wokeism is just the latest distraction tactic, not the cause.
forced silence -punishable by firing
This is hardly unique to Cisco. And it's common sense. At any company, if you spout off offensive or racist comments in a group setting, you're going to face repercussions. And, if they're bad enough, you face termination.
Even with the 1st Amendment Freedom of Speech, military service members can not say anything negative about their chain of command. I recall a 2-star general was fined 2 months pay for telling a joke about then President Clinton not inhaling as a lead in opening joke to a speech he was giving. He wasn't in uniform, but he was listed at the event as "Major General John Doe" and therefor represented the military.
Just keep your comments to yourself or post them anonymously, don't do it with your name attached.
I go back and check the Chat history after the event and make a list of people I do NOT want to work with when they make blatant comments that are racist, divisive, confrontational or just designed to "stir the pot". I don't need their drama.
If anyone is working more than one job its probably because they can't make thier bills with how inflation has been and with how Cisco isn't giving cost of living increases.
We have asked about increases in multiple checkins and the leadership shrugs it off like its annoying.
People don't have enough money to pay the bills. No one I know would be working two jobs if they didn't have to to make ends meet.
The wokism is a problem because it is all Cisco does anymore. Every meeting is bs pronouns, describing oneself, how to be more politically correct, and how to be more global. There isnt any substance to what we do anymore.
We used to be a company making cool things for customers.
Now we are just a company of following whatever blackrock tells our leadership team to do. (Our CEO is on the board of blackrock).
Blackrock is the evil mega corp that owns over half of American companies and pushes CCP garbage around the world.
Like - when China was invading Hong Kong Blackrock went through the hong kong stock exchange to any companies they influenced and required that all hong kong businesses check with the CCP on any major business decision before making them.
Blackrock pressures American businesses to do things that will weaken and infantalize the American populous so China can weaken its enemies. The CCP has been doing this stealth war for decades.
The CCP is the chinese communist party - the evil political sect that pushes mass surveillance of their population and who have committed the genocide of the uyghurs.
Many Cisco field reps are not only working two jobs, BUT their second job directly competes with Cisco and they steer their customers to purchase the non-Cisco product
I don’t get why everyone plays up his bad the wokeism is. It’s not that much. And Cisco was in the sh----r LONG before the wokeness.
Fran's decision to turn Cisco into Woketopia was the last straw for Cisco.
Given her influence over Chuck and, therefore, everyone's career, there weren't going to be any dissenters in the ELT. All of them already are just playing along to get the big paychecks. They're perfectly fine with Fran providing them with woke propaganda for them to regurgitate.
It's fascinating to see how one overly powerful person can destroy an organization. RIP Cisco.
Nothing left to care about at this company. Its just politics and p-o
A few of the people are good people, but the ones with skills they can take elsewhere are doing so in droves.
When you treat employees like replaceable cogs, force them (in many ways - forced useless trainings, forced PTO, forced follow-our-agenda, forced med proceedures, forced silence -punishable by firing), and generally just treat them like dirt - what else can they expect?
The company is dying, a barely shuffling zombie.
Honestly, I cannot imagine anyone except those who fully believe in the "woke" narrative are truly in. I hope this changes in time, but with Fran and her team in power I think it's here to stay for awhile. I've watched great thought leaders leave recently who could shape Cisco's future walk away. Many without amazing new roles to speak of which says quite a bit regarding the current situation. I'm sad about it all.
@mgj+1f7jmG80, I'm in that same boat with you. I work hard during my 40 hrs, but the days of working 45, 50, more are long gone.
Cisco showed me no loyalty when they LR'd me the first time. They've shown no loyalty since I've returned. I'm in it purely for the retiree medical access plan to provide me healthcare until I'm eligible for Medicare/Medicaid.
To @iwv+1f7jmG80's comment about medical benefits that actually pay the majority of the charges or that other companies have FUN, that was not my case at two jobs between my first and current Cisco roles.
The first one, I was a contractor and I was being offered to convert to an FTE where I'd get benefits. From what I understood from fellow FTE's, the medical wasn't too bad, but it was more expensive than Cisco's. There was no fun and I was working 60-70 hr weeks being paid straight time for every hour worked. I realized that I was going to take a major pay cut converting to FTE because I'd still work the same hours, but then I'd be salaried instead of hourly making overtime.
The second one, the medical benefits as an FTE were terrible and almost as expensive as contractor's benefits. There was no fun and I was micromanaged for 40 hrs a week.
Some are brazen enough to post their second jobs on social media
@udt+1f7jmG80, sadly Cisco workers working two jobs is nothing new. I don't understand how people can be so brazen or stupid enough to post about it though. Why would they think any company would want to hire them knowing that they're working for another company as the same time knowing that they could be "billing" them hours for work they're not doing same as they're doing to Cisco.
Back in '07 to '10, there was a new guy who joined our team and quickly stopped coming into the office regularly, and any task he was given, no matter how minor or simple, always took 24 hrs or more to deliver. If it was wrong, he'd say he misunderstood and would correct it, but again it would take another day or more. Turns out he was working a second job and had outsourced his Cisco job to somebody overseas and was sending them work for them to do and send back to him to present as his own work. He was gone in less than six months because he couldn't juggle the two jobs.
Extremely unlikely anyone will still be working at 59 1/2 at Cisco. Your a target at 40
@Catalyst6509UpTime You are correct, a certain security vendor is taking many of the best security people whether that is on the product or security sales side. JP is a complete joke in the product side as he cannot handle Collab and Security. He is all talk. On the security sales side, their sales leader is clueless. SB has no idea what she is doing. Security venture with lesser quality products are growing their sales by double digits and SB is responsible for no to negative growth.
I left Cisco almost a year ago and have no regrets. Yes... you have to work harder partially because there is a steep learning curve when you join another company... However, something that you may not realize is that other companies have FUN. They reward their employees with stock and salary increases as part of the normal process. You have medical benefits that actually pay the majority of the charges. Don't let your skills get stale, take the chance and see what other more positive positions are out there. Start updating your LinkedIn... you might be pleasantly surprised at what opportunities are out there.
Us "older folks" - start planning on working until you are 59 1/2. Make the day you turn 59 1/2 as the day you plan to have minimal cash on hand, by maxing out your Roths. When one gets to that window of having four to five years left; outlook definitely changes towards work, money - and especially with putting up with work politics.
Still working but getting close to that window myself. I can see why younger folks sorta look at oldies like myself in a different perspective. I don't blame the younger generation bolting for better jobs and more money; the options, RSUs, and ESPP from all my years at Cisco fueled my current mindset.
Those in your 30s - IF Cisco is NOT throwing serious cash your way, AND you are contributing big time - you are missing out. Those years of big investing in your 30s will change your outlook in your 50s.
CHOOSE WISELY - especially in the critical high productive years.
Peace
The younger people with marketable skills are the ones going, leaving behind folks like me. I am mid-fifties and even though I have strong skills I'm too old to be moving now. So I'll stay here, do my job (but no more) and take the check for the next three years until I retire early. My days of going the extra mile are gone. If they lay me off in two years then that would be perfect. People like me don't rock the boat and just keep taking the pay check and the health/pension plan. If I were younger I'd have gone when Cisco watched the cloud transition sail off without being on board or when all this "Cisco is a software company" nonsense started. Cisco is stuffed full of people like me who think exactly the same way.
Currently there are so many better jobs out there that make more money and suck less.
Doing actual work isn't so bad if you like who you are working with, like what you are building, and are learing through interesting challenges.
Many people left at Cisco are working a second job at home including first and second level managers
Some are brazen enough to post their second jobs on social media
Amazing that Chuck and his HR lady allow this, as any other company would terminate those employees without warning as this violates employment agreement
They will be back at Cisco in 2 years or less once they realize that at other tech companies you have to "work" 8hrs or more per day compared to Cisco where most of us put in just 1.5hrs per day, then chill the rest of the day but still get paid for a full day's worth of work.
Why would any sane person even think about leaving Cisco.
Cisconians .. what a terrible term. I cringe every time I read that.
Cisco has too many blank check government contracts to be the next Sun.
Is Cisco the next Sun? Sure feels like it.