And it’s not just because management forces us to be mini-AMs, or because buggy software and bad TAC makes us spend all our time in post sales he-l. It’s the technology. We barely talk networking any more. The portfolio is way too big for having generalist engineers to be tenable.
19 replies (most recent on top)
1 - Complicate Licensing more that before when Customers request is to simplify
2 - Complicated Product architectures, without the need to be
3 - Embrace Agile Dev Culture Cancer
4- Sunsetting products that sell , with code maintenance shipped to India
5- Non existing Quality Assurance, patches that break productive systems
6- TAC sux but it has always sucked since mid 2000's, its basically a filter for the BUs witch suck also but a bit less, it works cuz most other vedor's TACs are equally worthless
@3pqr+1fGDOL3k
"Technical SE here and a CCIE. Masters degrees in engineering. Explain to me, why is it that the SE has to sort out licensing issues and have to chase this sh-t down?" There's that old school cisco SE and constant college grad arrogance everyone knows and loves (to hate). The SE community and sales a a whole have done a cr-p job for many, many years. I will concur that the offshoring of software and TAC support just expedited and now perpetuate things. The ACI TAC has been decimated but they continue to toss people at that garbage called hyperflex and UCS. That mess is a geek squad level support platform and we can't even do that so what do you want when you add the arrogance of the SE? How about selling some services too rather than whining? Better yet, leave and take your buds with you. Wonder why sales has been decimated including the SEs? They suck almost as bad as the support.
Given that perspective, SEs are superfluous.
I’m a TME, but I think the SE role is critical. The trouble is that the SEs are now everything but SEs. Mostly, they are account admin and AM assistants. Occasionally they get to play real SE, but this isn’t something you can do 10% of the week. And with the huge portfolio and lack of hands on and training, they are borderline useless on the tech.
I really wonder what the AMs are doing? I work all the time with major, major customers and I know many of the SEs (or whatever title they now have) globally and yet, I almost never see an AM. Mostly, I never even know who they are. One account, one of our biggest customer organizations, I would not know the client director if he was sitting next to me. That’s pretty typical.
The reality of the situation is blatantly obvious. None of the leadership at Cisco actually believes they're selling innovative, game-changing technology to customers anymore. Networking is now a commodity.
Given that perspective, SEs are superfluous.
Of course, customers continue to be given overly complex technology by Cisco BUs that isn't easy to consume so their expectations are that the SE is going to help them make the junk work.
What a rotten life for an SE. It sounds like it's time to pull the ripcord.
The SE can quit if the SE does not like to do what his AM asks of him. Nobody is holding a g-n over the SE's head.
SE leadership is too interested in metric that don't matter. Are you assigned to the opportunity, is the opportunity tech closed, do you have your architectures reviews updated, is sage updated, how many demos did you do this month, did you get your IACV training completed, roll up what you are seeing with TAC, can you do your check-in, etc. Not one of them focused on what the SE should be doing - learning and teaching customer Cisco technology
The Cisco SE role has turned into an assistant to the AM. The moral of the Cisco SE is at its lowest point ever.
SE has to do all that cause the SE leadership is focused on the wrong things.
Technical SE here and a CCIE. Masters degrees in engineering. Explain to me, why is it that the SE has to sort out licensing issues and have to chase this sh-t down?? Why? Why SE that has to chase TAC and send a million emails? Why the SE that waste half week when all this sh-t needs to be done? SE should own the room and sell the technology. Not all this sh-t. Others should do that and let SE be SE and be the techno magician like the old days. Instead we have to read up on all licensing sh-t. It is completely BS. Portfolio is impossible to begin to understand. Cisco so complex now and customers lose plot.
One big reason for this:
Politically-aligned, grin-f*ing and back-stabbing SEMs, who kiss the a of the SED.
The senior SE leadership role became a glamour job a decade ago. The days of senior SE leaders being able to come in and have a substantive discussion with customers is long gone.
They're all just overhead now.
Completely agree, the SE leadership from SEM to Executive have tried to be so much more business then technical that the Cisco SE is no more. The Cisco SE is nothing more than a glorified account admin for the AMs. The SE leadership is responsible for this and takes no accountability for letting it get to this point. SEMs, SSEMs, and SEDs are focused on their dashboards so they look like they are so business savvy, but they have forgotten what it is to technically lead. If they want to be an AVP, OD, or RM, then go apply for it instead of destroying the Cisco SE role.
The Cisco SE is long gone. The current Pre-Sales Engineering executive leaders from TC, EK, to the SEDs and down to the SEMs, have destroyed the Cisco SE by trying to make them more AM-like in running the business vs letting them be technical. Now that has happened, they are focused on pooling SEs to bring down their cost of SEs and increase the executives and SEDs salaries. I never thought I would see this in my career.
The extremely low pay means good ones leave.
Not hard to imagine whats happening. Every SE i have ever met as a customer or as an employee has been almost worthless. they don't know their own products, they don't know their customers, they dont know sh!t, except when their commission check clears. Im sure there are good ones, but i think as a culture, this role needs to go away or change or something.
SE=silly engineer. who kneeds them, lolz
Cisco won the networking battles in the late 90s by getting new features to customers faster than the competition and relying on the SEs and the TAC to make sure customers were able to get them deployed.
Unfortunately, it enabled the wrong culture in the Engineering organization. Despite becoming the 800 lb. gorilla in the industry with massive market share, the Engineering organization continued to ignore quality to the point that the industry embraced Software Defined Networking (SDN) to get out from under Cisco's dysfunction.
Ultimately, Cisco failed to use its market dominance in networking to gain similar success in adjacent markets. Given today's commoditization of networking as a result of the customers' SDN push, Cisco is forced to focus on cost-cutting to meet Wall Street's margin expectations.
Heroic SEs that try to keep customers happy are now like the band on the Titanic. Unfortunately, as they work 60 hour weeks, their management is focused on figuring out how to lower their cost to the company. The only way for SE work-life balance to improve is for them to realize that they can't do this on their own - or move to a company that rewards their efforts.
We used to be big swinging di-ks that owned the room and now we don’t even know our own products. There are still some good ones here, but we have been neutered by management and the weight of the entire product line.
Licensing BS doesn’t help either. But yeah jack of all trades master of none. You better believe our competitors’ engineers are focused. That’s how they beat us.