Thread regarding Cisco Systems Inc. layoffs

For security reasons, they don't want people showing up at the office before being let go. Some employees are so entitled, they would not accept being LR'ed. Some would bring a g-n and take their frustration on the mgr. The company is facing financial difficulties, what part of that don't you understand? Besides, Cisco or Google or most tech companies are not union shops. If they don't want you, there is nothing you can do about it.

Maybe that's for Google or Twitter, but Cisco has rarely turned off anyone's badge before their termination date. When I was LR'd in 2016, my badge worked for 6 weeks until my official termination date, but I had my laptop and building access for those 6 weeks. My system accesses to anything other than HR, payroll, printers, and email were basically shutoff, but I still had access to the building.

Financial difficulties?! That's hilarious. Didn't Google make something like $12B just last quarter in profits? Not revenue, profit. I can't find the post by the Google employee who was just let go who shared the info. Just because their profits are down, they're still making money hand over fist. Even Cisco's LR this time is, according to Chuck, not about cost savings and about re-allocating resources. (No, I don't believe it. It's really about driving up stock prices to keep Wall Street happy temporarily.)

But you're right, there's nothing you can do about it if they want you gone.

So google actually had a plan. They notified people right away. Vs Cisco that says they’re laying off then takes weeks or months to decide who to fire, with everyone stopping work why they wait and worry.

You must be new to Cisco or not familiar w/ Cisco. Cisco has gone back and forth between immediate and advanced notice for LR's. As someone who's experienced layoffs from other companies and had both no-notice and advanced notice, I much prefer the advanced notice.

In 2008?, Cisco announced a 2,300? employee reduction that leaned more towards getting rid of SJC workers and replacing them in RTP (and India to a lesser degree). I don't remember the advanced notice details as I didn't know anyone impacted at the time.

In 2011, Cisco announced an upcoming workforce reduction, with the #'s to be determined based on the #'s of employees who took the first early retirement offer. Once the application deadline for the ER passed, they announced in Apr that the WFR would be x% and would be something like 5,500 or 6,500 employees. I get 2011 and 2016 numbers mixed up. They said employees would be notified between Tue - Thurs the first week of Aug.

In 2016, Chuck announced during the year-end earnings call that there would be a 6,500 or 5,500 employee LR. Emails went out that night inviting employees for 1-on-1 meetings with their managers the next morning.

In 2019, they handled the LR the same way with no notice, but it was several months later than the 2016 one, so people were still on the "terminal leave" period when the pandemic hit, so they extended their separation date by several months.

In 2020, they again provided advanced notice because they called it a "voluntary" separation where they prepared a list of "possibly impacted" people and if you were on that list, and met some requirements, you could take an early retirement. For those that didn't meet the ER requirements, you could "voluntarily" leave, or wait and see if you were impacted, and if you were, you could take the severance immediately or try to spend 60 days looking for an internal role and if you didn't find it, get 60 days less severance.

I don't recall any people screaming about how bad or cruel Cisco was about giving advanced notice on that one, just that they thought it was cruel to be letting people go during the shutdown.

Cisco has been doing annual employee reductions pretty much since 2008. I'd rather know how many people are affected, what the package is, and when it will happen so that I can make educated guesses about making any large financial decisions rather than have just bought a new car and find out next week that I no longer have a job. With advanced notice, I can even look for a job and quit if I find something I like better before I get cut or at least have a head start on the search.

I don't know why people would "worry" once Cisco makes the announcement as you should be wondering if this year is the year every year.

if you find a better job, and you are going to resign, you probably email to your manager to let him/her know your resignation , so what is the difference here ?

Sure, you email your manager so it's in writing, but usually you give your manager some sort of in-person head's up about the email, either just before or just after sending it.

I don't know of anyone who's ever just dropped off their badge, laptop, keys, etc. and emailed in their termination without ever talking with their manager or HR.

I do not get it ,
if you find a better job, and you are going to resign, you probably email to your manager to let him/her know your resignation , so what is the difference here ?

What if the email lands in your spam folder and keep working for the next 20 years?

You get to keep the red stapler.

"Were Google/Meta/Microsoft /AWS and MS also the “#1 place to work”?"

Very good point! That's where Cisco UK beats them all! Yadda, yadda, yadda! Bring on the Tech Talks!

What if the email lands in your spam folder and keep working for the next 20 years?

So google actually had a plan. They notified people right away. Vs Cisco that says they’re laying off then takes weeks or months to decide who to fire, with everyone stopping work why they wait and worry.

For security reasons, they don't want people showing up at the office before being let go. Some employees are so entitled, they would not accept being LR'ed. Some would bring a g-n and take their frustration on the mgr. The company is facing financial difficulties, what part of that don't you understand? Besides, Cisco or Google or most tech companies are not union shops. If they don't want you, there is nothing you can do about it.

If you are being laid off. Does it matter how you get it? Just move on and pray a good severance. Its a job. Whether they look at you in the face or not, you are still losing your job. Yall took "we are family" literally

I've never considered an employer, or work, as "family". Like you said, it's a job. But, yes, it does matter how I get notified. They interviewed me in person. I get employee performance reviews in person. I can damn well get terminated in person. Email me the details, please, but give me the news face-to-face.

I don't see what is so bad about getting the LR via email as long as they provide the contact information of an HR person to talk to if you have any questions. i would feel better processing the bad news alone and not in front of someone. Who wants to cry in front of some cold HR person?

HR doesn't usually give people the bad news. HR just prepares the letters that managers or directors have to read. Whether or not the manager is cold or not is debatable and depending on the individual.

As someone who's worked a companies that have been acquired and laid off as part of the acquisitions, or startups that failed, I can say I've never cried when notified. I've been stunned speechless, or completely pi---d off, but why would I cry? As the major breadwinner in my household, it's been scary to be notified especially when the notification is 2 wks notice and the severance is an additional 2 wks if you agree not to sue, but I'd rather them have to face the consequences of totally disrupting someone's life than let them get off easy and just email me. Then again, I'm old and I prefer a phone call to a text message.

How do you know I even saw the email? What if I was on PTO at the time, or as one social media post I saw about a Google employee, traveling for Google and being clear across the country when my Google email/account access is shutoff. Most people have OOO auto-replies setup when they're traveling.

I don't want managers laying people off, but the person who made the decision.

that would have to a Zoom firing if not email.

Apparently Google's CEO Sundar Pichai’s said, “I take full responsibility for the decisions >that led us here.”, so someone asked “What does taking full responsibility entail? >Responsibility without consequence seems like an empty platitude. Is leadership >forgoing bonuses and pay raises this year? Will anyone be stepping down?”

What is the reprimand for the actions by this guy that cause many families that got into this crisis? Nothing! That is why a lot of employee give no sh-t about listen to most of those executives' cr-p(if not all). (aka pod cast, update, all-hands, ...)

If you are being laid off. Does it matter how you get it? Just move on and pray a good severance. Its a job. Whether they look at you in the face or not, you are still losing your job. Yall took "we are family" literally

Were Google/Meta/Microsoft /AWS and MS also the “#1 place to work”?

What is wrong with UK SE team, that it comes up in almost all discussions here?
Is it one pi---d off troll responding everywhere, or the environment is so toxic there?

Google, Meta, MS, Amazon does not do mass layoffs every year and sometimes quarterly like Cisco does. At Cisco that's a toxic culture that many management personnel, Directors etc. use as leverage to impose a "rule" of fear. At UK that is certainly true of the SE team as several has written already. Fear does not breed respect, loyalty and open, innovative thinking.

In contrast to Cisco, this is what Google is offering to its laid off employees. : "In the US, Google has promised the following benefits to those affected: a full salary for the notification period (60 days), a severance package starting at 16 weeks salary plus two weeks for every additional year at Google, accelerated vesting of at least 16 weeks of GSU, 2022 bonuses, and remaining vacation time, as well as six months of healthcare, job placement services, and immigration support. Outside the US, the company will support employees in line with local practices"

Compare that with Cisco severance and you will have a hard time from throwing up.

Reference: https://www.timesnownews.com/business-economy/industry/mass-layoffs-severance-benefits-offered-by-google-microsoft-meta-to-impacted-employees-article-97219160

If Google is firing with e-mail, I wonder how AWS would do it?
With a text message on a phone?
Or they would not even bother to send anything?

“I take full responsibility for global warming”.

I don't see what is so bad about getting the LR via email as long as they provide the contact information of an HR person to talk to if you have any questions. i would feel better processing the bad news alone and not in front of someone. Who wants to cry in front of some cold HR person?

Cisco generous with severance? How about the people that relocated to the Bay Area only to be LRd? Those people take an enormous financial & emotional hit

I highly doubt Google eliminates roles of people that recently relocated... Cisco does

I don't want managers laying people off, but the person who made the decision.

The person deciding should be the one to do the deed.

I have been through a lot of LR cycles at Cisco over the years and I believe the company has always been forthright and generous with their severance packages. Granted, having to wait for D-Day is hard on everyone but the company is complying with state and city laws with advanced notice, unlike other employers who simply block out your access and tell you "today's your last day".