Thread regarding Ford layoffs

Link to Local 1970. Site looks pretty stale. You'd think they'd be more active in this climate.

https://region1a.uaw.org/uaw-local-1970-ford-salaried-workers/about-us

I am surprised to see all of you saying this.

I am a hard 'R' republican. And I know that most of the other frequent posters here are republicans too.

We despise unions. Always have. Our entire political party despises unions.

Now what? You think that maybe a union could help you? So you decide that maybe they're ok?

Are you going to all-of-the-sudden become pro-choice if your wife/girlfriend/daughter needs an abor---n?

You all need to stand firm in your resolve. Unions are bad. Do NOT unionize. Ford salary employees will NEVER unionize. And that's how we like it!

Where do I sign?

Added bonus of salaried workers unionizing is it’ll make JF and BF sweat. Maybe the suits will learn their actions have consequences.
If we’re all truly gonna be laid off one way or another we may as well have some fun with it on our way out.
We all know the next round is coming sooner rather than later, Ford has made sure we have very little to lose at this point.

We were part of local 1970 for a few years. We never ratified a contract because all of the contract proposals were garbage. They had a strong hourly mentality in them, and thank goodness, we were smart enough to reject them. Still, it took two or three years to decertify because once the UAW sinks its claws into you, they will /not/ let go.

You guys can do what you want, but it will be a horrible experience.

@gka+1nk6n6GK Agree with your overall point, except a couple nuances:

• UAW profit sharing checks are basically a bonus by definition. Just without personal performance as a factor. This year's checks were $9176 (source: free press), which is larger than many GSR bonuses over recent years -- depending on individual performance and business performance factor (which we saw in 2021-2022 has no transparency, and seems to be a way for upper management to cut our bonuses while padding their already obscenely large bonuses, by giving themselves a different multiplier).
• In place of merit increases, unions can negotiate raises that actually keep up inflation when their contract is up for negotiation. Over the last couple years, high end of the merit raise bracket is 3-5% which isn't even close to inflation.

The pros/cons you listed also seem to operate under the assumption that Ford's salaried workers would have to unionize with the UAW. There is also the option to form a local chapter with a non-UAW union and negotiate your own contract. There are a handful of unions for professional engineers, as well as other more general unions out there.

Cons to join the Union:
No more merit rasies
Force to return to the office (retalation)
Management treating you like a second class citzen (traitor)
No bonus
Still can be laid off (not fired)

Pros:
Cheaper Medical insurance
No more quarter PR (Union did not agree to it)
UAW profit sharing
First rights to come back from lay off.
Make HR have a hear attack LOL.
Pay 2 hours salary to Union Dues.

There are more but if you got a few years till retirement I think its a might be a good move

@rea+1nk6n6GK

Not saying Union is a bad thing, all for a local unions and do think engineering should consider a Union.

Just saying look at what agreements those guys had in place and how the UAW didnt fight for their jobs. Its a crime on how much the OEMs are outsourcing these days to save a couple bucks. Stellantis has a mandate that you have to consider contract from low cost areas first. (Italy, Brazil, Mexico, India)

It’s not local 1270, it’s local UAW 1970. They represent Body CAD designers/engineers and some test lab personnel and medical nurses/personnel. It is a salaried union. Everything is pretty much identical to non union salaried except cuts are done by seniority except for 10% than management can protect and guaranteed overtime pay if you are approved/asked to work more than 40 hours a week.

@lcz+1nk6n6GK you know who else has been outsourced? not union salary workers, right now before our eyes too.

looks like union local 1970 is still here btw... maybe they have the right idea

I think it is brilliant idea. That is one of the proven ways to safe ourselves from incompetent and greedy management. We just need someone brave enough to organize and facilitate creation of union. This task will not be easy but when there is a will, there is a way. You will my support for sure

@ayi+1nk6n6GK
What you’re describing honestly sounds awesome. I personally would love to have a guaranteed lunch (or coffee or whatever) break. I’d love to not have meetings scheduled after hours, sometimes even as late as 11:30pm for “urgent” issues, without any overtime pay. I’d love to not be asked to work 12 hour days or weekends without overtime pay or comp time.
All of the inconveniences that you’re describing (undisturbed breaks, only being required to work during working hours unless overtime pay is approved) are things we should strive for. Work should not be allowed to take over our lives, and if that’s inconvenient for the C suite folks, then oh well.

Body CAD is Union. Looks some desginer up in CDS and ask them who there Union Stewart is and contact them. They can help you

Joining the Union will not prevent you from getting laid off. But in the contract you will get a 90% pay and first rights for a call back.

90% per liftime of the contract about 4 years. And it will make it harder for Ford to replace you with contract employees. Since if their is a req you have the first right to get it.

Being in a union is not the answer. I worked with out of state IT people who were unionized and it was a chore to get them to do anything. They were guaranteed a 15 minute coffee break at 10:00 and 2:00. That 15 minute break turned into 45 every morning and afternoon. If you were in a meeting, poof it was over because it was break time. If you were in the middle of a project, poof it was on hold for break time. Nothing superseded the break. Meetings did not go past quitting time. Grievances were filed for trivial nonsense like the coffee machine was empty or there was no fresh fruit in the cafeteria. I agree that Ford takes advantage of people, but organized labor makes things much more inefficient. Also, we have way too many process, audit and compliance people. With a union, you have another group of non-contributes in the shop stewards.

Try Local 1970

Why? This is corporate America at its finest!! This is not 1961. 30 and out is over especially with no company pension.

@vsr+1nk6n6GK It's true that Boeing's unionized engineers aren't "immune" to layoffs, but you saying this proves that the union isn't effective is a gross simplification.
Did a quick skim of the 2020 Collective Bargaining Agreement between SPEEA and Boeing:
https://www.speea.org/Bargaining_Units/Negotiations/Boeing_Prof_Tech/2020/2020%20Prof%20Full%20Redline.pdf

Article 8 specifically deals with the procedure that Boeing employees have negotiated for layoffs. This includes

• 2 weeks advance notice for layoffs
• Management to review overtime in affected teams to make sure remaining engineers not over-burdened while taking over laid off team member's work
• Employees are provided "retention indexes" which are updated at least annually. This index reflects seniority and performance history. Layoffs begin with the lowest "retention index" employees. From what I can tell, this is intended to give people insight into where they stand when layoffs come around, so it doesn't feel like a crapshoot for everyone.

People are on this forum complaining about how the "dead weight" always manages to avoid being laid off, and how we get no notice when layoffs are coming. Boeing's salaried union has addressed both of these major concerns. Seems like it would be within reach for us to do the same.

@orw+1nk6n6GK Did some digging on UAW 1270 online and couldn't find anything. Is UAW local 1270 NLRB recognized? Do you have any link with more info?
Asking because if there is a salaried union in place I am absolutely interested in joining.

In a union, we could work to negotiate a contract that prohibits the company from making us train our replacements in low cost countries. We would have a grievance process to legitimately raise issues without fear of retaliation.

No one is under the delusion that a union would mean perfect unlimited job security, but we could use a contract to require existing employees to get priority for reassignment in the new software and EV roles, and to negotiate better severance packages for those who do get cut. And we can always leverage the threat of us all walking off the job and shutting the whole company down to hold those at the top accountable.

Having a union just means we can negotiate our terms of employment on equal footing, rather than being crushed into the dirt by those with way more money and power.

I feel it is time for all gsrs to join a union. They are in Europe and yes they got cuts but as a group you can negotiate better deals. We have been taken advantage enough by LLs and the UAW and its time to act like the new uaw president.

its pretty obvious that unionism is not a silver bullet, we need militant force. the weak knead and cowards in this thread need not apply.

Only if slacker horrible employees (you know what I'm talking about) are able to be fired and not saved time after time.

As already mentioned, some salaried Ford employees are unionized, but that doesn't prevent layoffs. Also, Boeing's engineers have been unionized for a long time, but they also aren't immune to layoffs. For salaried workers, about all a union does for you is force you to pay union dues, and ensure even the worst performers get paid the same as the best.

Everybody here hates unions because their preferred politicians tell them to. Even if a union would protect them. You're wasting your breath here encouraging unions...

There is already a salaried union, UAW local 1270. When cuts come, they get cut as well, but the lowest seniority go first except that management can protect up to 10% from cuts by seniority. Salary union also get overtime for all hours over 40 hours but it must be pre-approved.

Join the existing salary union, I'm sure they would love to increase the membership.

Corporate America is gonna be Corporate America. All of these high level executives sit on each other’s boards and vote to approve each other’s obscene pay packages and offshore our jobs. That’s why this problem can’t be solved by “just working somewhere else.” This is bigger than Ford, but boy do we need it. Solidarity with EVERYONE who WORKS for a living (especially the people who build the cars and even the first couple levels of management). This is how we stand up to the owner/investor class.

Ford isn’t the only company doing layoffs right now, if I quit I run the risk of being laid off somewhere else. And the job market is pretty atrocious. The “just quit” approach is way easier said than done.
I’d rather organize to protect my job at my current work place. Better the devil you know than the one you don’t, especially if you have your foot on it’s throat.

NO. Do you know what people do when they feel they don't get treated well at a company they quit. Only losers stay and want to join a union because they know they won't get anything better anywhere else because either their work ethic sucks or they don't have in demand skills.

If Ford is not treating you right then quit and work elsewhere or try self- employment. Stop being a LOSER.

Ford ain't worth all that! Seriously, once you move on to a new company you realize how toxic Ford is. I wouldn't stay there even if salaried unionized.

I’d absolutely put some money towards a union lawyer if that’s what it takes. At this point I’d take a decent pay cut to not have to worry about being laid off every 6 months.

@gew+1nk6n6GK you wont have to worry about paying a lawyer if you lose your job ! lol

Links to contact union organizing help:

• https://teamster.org/about/contact-teamsters/
• https://www.laborlab.us/start_here
• https://aflcio.org/formaunion/contact
• https://workerorganizing.org/support/
• https://www.iww.org/organize/
• https://uaw.org/organize/contact-uaw-organizing/

I'm not paying a single penny to a fu----g lawyer.

I mean no disrespect to anyone here. but f that.

Great idea! Boycott until we have a salary union!

YES! If anyone has experience with this, please let us know the next steps to get this set up

Yes, organize before it is too late. We need a union organizer to get on this site and help us do it.

time for democracy in the workplace!!

I’m in. Organizing is the only way to save our jobs with the current trajectory.