I have been seeing many high earners, very talented people, hard working people, veterans, all being let go. I can’t wrap my head around the logic of this LR. Almost as if they are targeting the backbone of the company in terms of knowledge, experience and competence. This LR seems to me more and more inefficient and mismanaged. It may be the final signal to leave the sinking ship.
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My contacts at Arista are salivating at the thought of picking up good ex-Cisco Engineers
Cisco is decimating people with knowhow, actual innovators with PhDs with actual products and standards to their names.
I've had to deal with many of those standards. Some are great, but many are absolute disasters. Likewise I've worked with a few PhDs who have done things entire industries of PhDs said were impossible and I've worked with many PhDs for whom everything was impossible. The only architect I can name so great he redefined his industry for decades is Seymour Cray and he never had a PhD so it's clearly the ability to learn and apply, not the title that matters.
Coders code, they rarely design and architect a solution to an industry approved standard.
Most of Cisco's Principal Engineers and even some Distinguished Engineers know nothing about functional decomposition, refactoring, coupling and cohesion, scaling, systems that change dynamically. parallelizing tasks, and many more basic skills you sometimes learn before entering college but should spend a lifetime refining. They don't know the difference between requirements, design or implementation, and I'm not sure I ever worked with any "high level" person there that know what an interface is and why you need to manage their definition and implementation. Most teams in a silo can't communicate effectively and working across silos is often brutal. While hardware was always far more disciplined and capable than software too many programs didn't have a systems staff defining what they should do and in the worse case whole systems needed to be redesigned as a result. Cisco makes endless mistakes that take years to fix, and on the software side I've seen projects overrun by factors of dozens.
I've lead the "here is a clean sheet of paper and coarse requirements for a large scale system doing what no one else has done before so there are no patterns to follow" programs with many successive releases, limited budgets and time and delivered. I'm astonished at the basic first principles we applied to make that happen that Cisco was never be able to do. Too many of Cisco's people not only haven't been refining those skills but lack them outright which is why Cisco has been for 30 years and will continue to be heavily dependent on acquisitions.
On "a solution to an industry approved standard," why has Cisco often disavowed interoperability with things as straightforward as SFP+ modules or things using standard protocols like SIP?
"PhD in Computer Engineering"
You should be able to find a job in the hardware group! If not, this company is truled doomed.
beginning of the end of Cisco AMEN
On the leader check-in, there were a LOT of leaders in the chat complaining bitterly that top performers were taken out without their input (by clots above them).
"I was just let go too. I had a PhD in Computer Engineering with 3 patents at Cisco. The director I reported to was also let go. He was a talented and hardworking dude. Cisco, it's your loss."
It clearly means you do not belong there. It is a bit like living in an under developed country, with a world class skill, and no one can utilize your skills. On a hindsight, and in due time, you will be very glad you end up somewhere, where your skills and contributions are appreciated.
What they do not understand is brilliant minds being LRd by the clueless slimy ELT gravitate to roles elsewhere and they won’t look upon Cisco favorably. To a person, the ELT and their first line are utterly useless.
McKinsey was called in to various offices some time ago to review
Where those highly paid vultures go trouble follows ....
From what I have seen with my friends and colleagues around the world who are impacted
If you hit your sales target - no distinction was made
If you knew your customers and local nuance - no distinction was made
If you had post grad degrees - no distinction was made
It really seems like a cost saving exercise done by an accountant without understanding really what folks brought to the table
ELT need to be held accountable when juniper Forti etc take more business
Anyone who was let go thinking of not signing the agreement and suing due to being a white “older, 50s, male? I’m reviewing the list of who was let go in my group and several others and it’s about 95% old white guys…Agisim? Racism?. Many Minorities/females in same groups who are far less qualified and hard working didn’t get the ax…. Very tired of the DEI bias within Cisco on the hiring front, and now on the layoff front .
I was just let go too. I had a PhD in Computer Engineering with 3 patents at Cisco. The director I reported to was also let go. He was a talented and hardworking dude. Cisco, it's your loss.
Really good ones can easily find another job with better pay. Stop complaining and do your job or you will be next.
… Almost as if they are targeting the backbone of the company in terms of knowledge, experience and competence.
I’ve seen that in the 2008, 2011, 2016, & other layoffs. I know a guy who was in a critical role that was LR’d & Cisco struggled for around nine months before giving in & bringing him back as a contractor. He demanded, & got, a really high bill rate & was raking in big bucks for a while w/o having to put up w/ cleaning stuff. Finally they threatened to not renew him if he didn’t agree to convert to employee status & take a pay cut.
People with advanced qualifications and senior engineering credentials are threatening to senior management because they ask direct and difficult questions and are none tolerant of BS. Big qualifications require critical thinking skills that naturally challenge blind assertions. Cisco does not like such people, it wants blind obedience.
The decisions dont make sense… i think managers and directors making decisions short term to save themselves only….
I agree. I have the exact same view. Started with the LRs back in August 2023. Then again in Nov 2023. Very knowledgeable people I know personally and have worked with for years . Cisco is decimating people with knowhow, actual innovators with PhDs with actual products and standards to their names. I know I’ll get some know-it-all haters here who’ll claim PhDs are useless and standards and products have seen their days but that’s what you need to develop next-gen solutions - depth of thinking, knowledge and vision. Coders code, they rarely design and architect a solution to an industry approved standard.
So, I agree. Cisco appears to be in a rush to let go of all the dedicated smart people they have while retaining useless political parasites. I fear it’s the beginning of the end of Cisco .