What a crock of sh#te. Distances in India are not great. Indians don't need insurance? You utter uneducated arrogant tosser.
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The BIG difference in the modern USA (and I suppose England) is that without a steady stream of dollars you just keep going down a slope of no return. And that minimum cash stream is getting beyond the capability of people who don't have corporate jobs.
Consider: Car insurance: minimum of $1000 / yr
Health insurance: $xxxxxxxxxx /yr.
Medicines: $yyyyyyyyy/yr.
Housing: $zzzzzzzzzz/yr
Heating in winter: $ppppppppppp/yr
Fuel for car: $qqqqqqqqqqqq/yr
You die/ your family dies without this.
So people go deeper and deeper into debt to the friendly loan shark. They drive w/o insurance, they get arrested. They don't have money to pay the fine, they lose whatever job they have because they are absent. They lose their car. They lose their home. They get sick, they are afraid to go to the doctor.
All these are present in India of course. Except that you won't die just because your furnace doesn't work. Plus you can get around on bicycles, the distances are not that great.
For these reasons, the US workers MUST* get a much higher wage than the Indian worker actually needs. This is where free competition runs into hard reality.
Of course, none of this seemed to faze Queen Victoria etc when they rammed British imports into India and destroyed Indian industry. But anyway, the above is why there are hard floors to what the US can tolerate, WTC or no WTC. Equalizing with India is not tolerable.
By increasing local supply this will also do away with need for h1 f1 L1 and please that hire american segment too.
I have a single point fix.. the govt makes university education free for those with family income below 60k and highly subsidized for those 60k to 120k and puts a cap on fees for those above 120k ie govt subsidizes for all rather than penalizing the well off. This is probably the european approach....result is the barrier for entry into fte is broken..many more will break through. Pay the poor a living allowance also in university to get by.
Will need some cutbacks in defence budgets though :) huge outcry from lobbyists about socialism and russian conspiracy to keep back the u.s from some mythical robber capitalist valhalla
The alternative is increasing social unrest in the huge permanent underclass to be kept under control by a ruthless police apparatus.
Morally i would support free higher edu for poor than smugly ask them to get a STEM ms if they want to play in sfo sjc
4hbr - great article. The interesting thing is IT connectivity and s/w is a big factor enabling the FTE group to monopolize the control and money in their class.
I think you have to read all this in context. America is essentially a racist country. Remember they effectively had segregation till the 60s. Now they have voted in a right wing nutty President. Racial murders are happening every day...by the police. Beggars belief why anyone would want to emigrate there. Slowly jobs will leech out of the states towards India and Europe where employees are either just as good or better and certainly cheaper.
Worth a read
https://www.ineteconomics.org/perspectives/blog/america-is-regressing-into-a-developing-nation-for-most-people
No one wants to hire the Indian engineers and not just the US... https://qz.com/963530/h-1b-its-not-just-trumps-america-indian-techies-are-unwanted-from-east-to-west/
This post has turned into a racist rant. I just want to remind everyone that every race/ethnicity has their own good & bad. So let just get along because America is big enough for everyone.
I've worked with some of the nicest & brightest Indians in my tech career. Extremely hard working but needed to be micro-managed sometimes. And ideas & instructions might not get through during the first few meetings because of the language barrier. They tend to be a bit click-ish but that's normal. People like to hang with people they can relate to. They also like to move up and willing to work hard for it. That's the immigrant spirit.
White people are also very capable but love to talk and talk loud. Love to be manager without doing any work. White females in manager role are typically conniving and will stab anyone in the back in a heartbeat. White dudes are often lazy, don't know much, but love to hear their own voice. I can rattle off a long list of VPs/dirs./managers at Cisco in sales/AS/marketing/engineering who fit these profiles. Many of them are still here bs-ing at Cisco by leveraging their buddy system and butt-kissing skills to survive. But it's not all bad. I've had the pleasure working for some very creative & competent white managers.
The point is every race has its quirks so take it a look at yourself individually. If you don't have the skill sets then do yourself a favor and go get one. If not let somebody else who does in to do the work. Most of these folks are here to do the grunt work because they don't have the domain/industry knowledge that you do. That's your competitive edge and why you get paid more. So stop the whining and learn how to take advantage of it before the immigrants surpass you.
Disclaimer - I was born & raised in the US.
@MRXFGNw-2hrx, are you valley tech dorks so smug and self aggrandizing to think exporting you back and cutting more nerd jobs due to automation, etc. will bring us to recession? Obviously you've got zero grasp of economics or the economy. The bay area lives in a bubble- politically, economically, and socially. I would love to see a crash in tech in the area. It's been a while since housing and used cars were affordable- especially for the folks working out cafeterias in building 9 for the lizards in building 10 and janitors cleaning up after bad hygene and stink in buildings A-J.
Make India Great Again!!
Yeah, here's a reason to move the jobs to India:
http://www.gadgetsnow.com/jobs/95-engineers-in-india-unfit-for-software-development-jobs-claims-report/articleshow/58278224.cms
The Yanks should model immigration and work visa programme after the Australians. Best in the world.
@wwg and @cyw, in your dreams. Nothing is going to change until Trump and Republicans bring legislative change in the H1B visa program which is years away from now if ever at all undertaken by Senate. Trump carries a check list in his pocket. He has checked the H1B in the list so he is done with it. Just signing some vague executive order does not mean anything. Abuse continues. Unskilled low paid Indian tech labor will continue to flood the US.
And yes, if the games really begin then not only MDXs and Odysseys flood the market but housing market goes down with it too. So be careful there. It could plunge US economy in recession. Dont underestimate the foreign tech workers.
I think you'll find that they will just employ more staff overseas. Makes far more sense than employing in the states.
If it made so much sense that transition would have been completed long ago. If it were that easy they would not have kept asking US engineers to move to India over a decade ago.
There is a reason everyone knows of Silicon Valley and Bangalore but not West Craphole, Alabama or any of the foreign equivalents. There is more to building and maintaining top teams than low pay which should be a lesson to both employers and employees who strive for more.
I think you'll find that they will just employ more staff overseas. Makes far more sense than employing in the states.
This means nothing. He has not changed lottery system for H1 and reduced the H1 quota or put strict restrictions on abuse of L1 visas. Increased scrutiny is a vague language and companies will change the titles of job description and find some other loopholes. They have highly trained lawyers.
Apparently some Cisco organizations aren't planning to continue using H1Bs, managed services (body shops) or expensive American labor. Their big plan is to replace all of the above with new college hires. Maybe we can fill the ELT with recent grads too. They certainly couldn't do worse.
Labour arbitrage is a wonderful thing.
Afaik Aus navy has mothballed or put in low operational cycle several vessels incl submarines due to lack of manpower. The pvt sector like mining pays a lot more.
Yay...get rid of cheap labor. Replace with expensive American labor and export the jobs overseas....yay. While we are at it can we please stop yanks filling jobs in other countries too. Much as we find great comedy value from having you guys over here you can't have it both ways.
Good plan guys.
The Australian system was renamed and jiggled a bit - it's still largely in place. They did remove some occupations from the "skills" list (the list of those removed is online). In fact, I cannot believe the occupations that were on the old list, or even still remain on the new list. Like "Defense Force Officer". Australia imports their officers now?/
on another note australia cancelled its version of h1 yesterday. will be replaced by some reformed measure later after.
it will need an act of congress for real reform but in meantime the exec order will nudge the agencies to apply closer scrutiny and perhaps weed out the bottom 10% of misuse which was being let through under lenient oversight paradigm.
@nel Congress will pass any H1B bill put in front of them unless they don't want to get elected in the next election. Trump will make sure of that, think someone from Congress going back to their constituents and saying they support foreigners over Americans, that is a sure way of getting elected.
Only in your f---ing dreams
This means nothing. Trump signed an order instructing government agencies to perform a review of policies regarding the H1B program. For meaningful reform to happen - increasing the minimum wage paid or allowing H1B visa holders to work for any company and not as indentured servants as they must now- will require an act of Congress. What do you think the odds of that happening are? On one side are the most valuable companies on earth and on the other side are a few thousand tech workers.
Yes, it's about time we get rid of that broken misused program. Can't wait to hear from all the whinny 'leadership" from Cisco Fakebook google etc
Going to be a lot of Acura MDXs and Honda Odysseys up for sale in the coming months. Let the games begin!