And it's working. These constant layoffs are creating such an unhealthy work environment that many people are leaving to avoid having to deal with it each day - and have it affect their mental health.
And when people leave on their own, Oracle does not have to pay severance.
Now tell me this is not intentional.
My default view is always US based since we are a US company (with global locations) and of course there are country legal and union laws about layoff's that are applied in non-US places, but this idea that anyone in the US has a job for life or is "entitled" to work is laughable -we're all expendable - always and if you think you're guaranteed a job at Oracle or anywhere else in the US - you need to educate yourself on the realities of the business world. Public traded companies work for the shareholders - not employees, the goal of a corporation is to make money for them - not to share it with employees. You aren't entitled to anything but to be paid for work performed and Oracle is entitled to nothing more from you than that days work. Severance is discretionary and is a leverage to keep you from wasting time on lawsuits.
"Well, no one will doubt that you are an American."
Damn straight. I am an immigrant and a grateful American.
Well, no one will doubt that you are an American.
" there are many ENGLISH speaking countries."
Wow, talk about going over your head. I never said it was or even suggested it was the only one. I suggest you reread the posts, slowly. It's ironic you lecture me on English speaking countries, yet you have a problem with reading comprehension with the English language.
"what makes this a USA site"
Gosh, where should I begin:
The fact it's hosted in the USA AND is in English AND deals with a USA company AND the word usage 'layoff' itself has origins in Americanism. <-- notice the use of ANDs are inclusive
"Sure but since this is a USA site; ORACLE has most presence in N America, Oracle is a USA company, and the post is written in ENGLISH"
Oh illuminated one, there are many ENGLISH speaking countries, other than the Excited States, and what makes this a USA site. Limited thinking like yours, shows us why Oracle has issues.
Just to help you out ...
Great Britain
Australia
New Zealand
Canada
Are all ENGLISH speaking countries where Oracle would have to pay severance payments.
"pretty interesting, and in some cases so much more civilized"
Well, yes, USA has room for improvements. But last I looked we are the ones who created the Apple, Microsoft, Google, Netflix, Hollywood, Tesla, etc.
"The topic is about an American company operating overseas"
That is not the topic of the original post. The poster did not identify as operating in another country. So it's reasonable to assume he/she is in the Americas.
In fact, you have no proof the original poster is from another country mandating severance.
At any rate, no country Oracle operates in holds it's employees by gun point. So there. It's at-will employment.
"BUT this is an american forum, for an american company, with English as the spoken language."
The topic is about an American company operating overseas, and the need to conform to that country's laws. It doesn't matter at all if a company is American and everyone speaks English. You can't use that as a defense if you want to fire someone in a country where severance is mandatory.
Yes, dismissal procedures around the world are pretty interesting, and in some cases so much more civilized (or at least bogged down in protocol) than in the US:
"Laws in most countries impose rules on no-cause firings that force companies to pay some sort of severance pay. How much it costs to dismiss a given employee abroad often depends on the person’s final pay rate and length of service, and no-cause termination pay outside the U.S. tends to be highest where pay rates are highest. Severance costs are most expensive when the targeted staff member is long-tenured and highly compensated; these costs are cheapest when the employee is short-tenured and low-paid. But there are exceptions: A few high-wage countries, including Singapore and Switzerland, impose relatively light statutory severance pay obligations. ...
...In France mandatory prefiring procedures begin with a company’s sending a letter in French, via registered mail, to the targeted employee, summoning the individual to a meeting. This is followed by more notices, meetings, waiting periods, internal appeals and papers (also sent by registered mail). Chad and other Francophone African countries impose looser versions of these French-style requirements. Perhaps unexpectedly, even the common-law U.K. requires that businesses adopt in-house multistep dismissal procedures."
https://blog.shrm.org/public-policy/what-to-expect-when-dismissing-employees-outside-the-us
Must point out your hypocrisy regardless of where you are from. Let me break it down:
you are gaming the system to get severance. You want to leave but are staying for severance
you are mad at Oracle for, in your unproven accusation, gaming the system to deny you severance
"chill. A quick search will answer many questions about overseas layoffs"
No one is arguing there aren't other laws about severance. BUT this is an american forum, for an american company, with English as the spoken language.
I don't go to a Chinese forum and assume ppl posting there are from Germany. At any rate, the statement about at-will employment still stands. I don't think there is a country in which Oracle operates that has its employees at gun point.
Capice?
Some of you might want to take a deep breath and chill. A quick search will answer many questions about overseas layoffs, so no need for the name calling. Start here:
"...In contrast, jurisdictions outside the U.S. regulate reductions in force far more comprehensively. Overseas, layoffs (called redundancies or collective redundancies in Europe; retrenchments in India; and termination, change and redundancies in Australia) pose challenges because these jurisdictions subscribe to the notion of "indefinite" employment. Indefinite employment systems regulate, restrict or prohibit employee terminations and grant recourse to employees who do lose their jobs.""
From this article: https://blog.shrm.org/public-policy/what-to-expect-when-dismissing-employees-outside-the-us
“Good one. Are you 12 years old?”
No but I was there for 12 years
"Yes and that’s why you’re stuck at Oracle"
Good one. Are you 12 years old?
“Again the level of ignorance here is astounding”
Yes and that’s why you’re stuck at Oracle
you all sound so stressed. Just leave and life will be better for you. i know from experience.
"Oracle has more people in India
English is spoken in countries other than USA as well."
No it doesn't you dim wit. Again the level of ignorance here is astounding. It is like you are purposely obtuse. And English is just a criterion in my list of criteria. You are even too dense to understand.
Get your facts.
Oracle has more people in India
English is spoken in countries other than USA as well.
"In many countries, Oracle does owe a severance payment."
Sure but since this is a USA site; ORACLE has most presence in N America, Oracle is a USA company, and the post is written in ENGLISH.
But we're US people, we don't care about other countries and your babysitting unions, here you can be let go with no severance, it's discretionary - called "at will employment" and it applies to Oracle and to the employee - we can leave with no notice and they can fire us with no notice. Reality people, it's real
Dim Wit!
Local government Har jurisdiction over Oracle practices. In many countries, Oracle does owe a severance payment.
It sometimes help to think a bit before you respond.
A company does not owe you severance, you complete dim wit.
Let me explain how it works since you are slow in the head: your employment is at will. You can leave, a company can ask you to leave.