I just had an interview and the recruiter informed me Wells added a new compensation rule 3 weeks ago that promotions to a new team cap wage increases at 5% and the new pay could be delayed until Jan 2025. Has anyone else heard of this?
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For annual merit raise, sure. I thought for most genuine promotions to a higher level, people get in the 10-20% range. Although I don’t know how it differs for getting promoted via the year-end performance management cycle vs applying for an open role that is a level up and getting it.
Good time to reiterate that the CEO received an 18.4% raise this year. No promotion, no “exceeds” performance that we can see. Comparatively, he wasn’t at the “low end of his market-based pay”.
FHY!!!
Apparently most hiring (with the exception of backfills) is put off until 2025. I’ve never been part of a budgeting process, but what is the thought process here , all of a sudden the economy jan 1 is going to look drastically different than December 2024?
A 5% pay raise is almost unheard of at wells
Our OC will step up for increases. They have and do. They haven’t been the boogeyman. But, we have niche skills.
"maybe next year", they are even hedging on their lies. I'm starting to think that the executives know something big, and very very bad for WF, is coming soon.
It’’s true, I had an interview from P3 to P4 at another Department and recruiter said that there will be no increase in salary until maybe next year when the budget is in. I pulled my application the following day.
Yes, this is 100% true. Any exception has to be approved at the senior level (like an OC member). Another way to ensure new jobs go to offshore people who are mostly external hires.
Any executive that believes you can get the same quantity and quality of production out of employees after intentionally harassing them, tanking their morale, and decreasing their pay should be fired immediately. That's not how human nature works. Will there be very rare exceptions? Sure, but 95%+ you'll the the opposite reaction.
But hey, I have an open mind, let's cut all the executives pay for the next five years or so and see if we get better production out of them. If so, we can consider it for a wider audience. Sound good?
I heard about comp being delayed until Jan for promotions in current role. But, some recent internal hires were given above 5% for a new higher level position. That rate was in effect on the start date. I think there’s a kernel of truth in what you said, but it doesn’t affect every scenario.
I would note that not all of us are overpaid relative to the industry- many of us actually took relatively lower pay when joining WF early in our careers for perceived “upward mobility and training opportunities” prior to the accounts scandal because of the company’s “desirable reputation” (yes this is exactly how WF used to market itself to entry level hires) and have been trying to play catch up ever since.
So paying a external a lot more money than an internal is gonna bring costs down? Because that's what's going to happen after the internal laughs in the offers face and leaves the company shortly thereafter.
I don't think this scheme is about saving money at all, it's about getting rid of people and if it costs a bunch of money, Shart doesn't really give an S.
I am in the midst of interviewing with another FI and they generally pay the same with similar bonus. Slight pay cut but nothing worth mentioning. BofA seems to pay a tad lower as does US Bank. Can’t speak to Citi or others.
Ugly Truth incoming, put on your big-boy pants:
Everything said re: why HY is doing this is accurate. The flip side, is that WFC ridiculously overpays (particularly wrt Bonuses) compared to other Banks. There's no way HY is going to bring costs down through layoffs alone, they have to reduce overall compensation for the survivors while getting the same amount of work. Thus, you get compensation engineering policies such as this.
For those whose natural reaction is denial, I strongly suggest you interview at other FIs and earn your way to the point of getting an offer to see what your skills/experience are really worth since WFC has been "California Dreaming" for decades.
Bei Ling got us that 5%!!
Anyone want to bet that executives that get promoted to a new exec role won't be capped at a 5% increase? 😐
I guess this is what BL was referring to when she said that she was going to focus on fixing the fake interview scandal from two years ago
The other thing that's BS is that we all know they won't be increasing managers budgets for merits, so the whole 'you can adjust at year end' this is a complete lie. Sure, you COULD, but you won't be able to bring them up to what an external could get from day 1 without gutting your budget and shafting the whole rest of the team. Anytime this company says some version of 'we can address that later...' they are lying.
Hit the nail on the head, perfect analysis. External candidates haven't proven ANYTHING beyond that they can do an interview. If proven performance is the justification, then their offer should be garbage also, but that's not how this will work. What will wind up happening is that you'll be able to offer X to a candidate with only the approval of your manager, but for an internal if you want anything close to X you'll need an approval from the OC. It's a f***ing joke and a massive insult to every current employee.
Extra evil points for HY that they clearly came up with this BS and implemented it right before employee appreciation week. "Heart felt" my azz. F***ing liars. That's all HY is. Zero integrity, zero leadership, zero vision. This executive group will become a case study in business management schools.
@1jgs+1t5kc5zM said, "the rationale that was provided to managers is that if you are promoted, you are now slightly lower in the new salary range than you were in the old range - and this is appropriate, because you are "growing into " the new level, so no increase is appropriate until you start to prove out your capabilities in the higher level."
So then according to HY's logic, all external candidates should come in at the bottom of scale since they are unknown to WF - h**l, why should we even pay them at all since we don't know anything about them? (Unless they're from JPMC of course - then they automatically come in at the top.) This is yet another opportunity to overlook the existing workforce.
The stupidity of this is astounding. They've de-incentivized internal people from seeking and accepting promotions as well as going above and beyond in their current role to hopefully be eligible for a promotion. Why would someone take a higher level job with more responsibility, more headaches and more work and get nothing in return? And they wonder why they have a disengaged workforce??
I am so glad I'm close to retirement and won't have to deal with this much longer.
new policy and it is in effect.
laterals - no increase - period. that was previously policy but hiring manager at certain levels could make exception - no more.
new job with higher level (promotion) - if current salary is within the salary band for the new (higher) role - no increase. Increase may be considered at year end as part of regular salary planning. Job levels have 70-80% overlap in their salary ranges, so this in effect shuts of promotion-related increases outside of the year end review cycle. The rationale that was provided to managers is that if you are promoted, you are now slightly lower in the new salary range than you were in the old range - and this is appropriate, because you are "growing into " the new level, so no increase is appropriate until you start to prove out your capabilities in the higher level.
So I guess the best approach would be to inform the candidate that they are the top option and if they want an increase they'll have to quit, no notice, in advance of the offer being formulated? So technically they are an external hire? Is that the point we're at now? FHY.
@1zje+1t5kc5zM said, "There’s no way you can post for an actual new job that’s at a higher level and only get a deferred 5% increase."
Charlie said, "You must be new here. I'm an expert at inventing ways to lower employee morale and scr**ing over the people who work here."
From what I'm hearing, this new policy is in place already - as long as you're not under minimum for your new (higher level) role, you get promoted without a raise. This falls under the, "you can't make this s***t up category.
It’s a new policy change that went in recently. You were already not eligible for a raise in a lateral move (think this was a recent change too).
sounds like a miscommunication to me. They’re likely talking about a lateral move such as a P2 to P2 move where the new job may have more responsibilities but it’s still considered a P2 role.
There’s no way you can post for an actual new job that’s at a higher level and only get a deferred 5% increase
He will pull his golden ripcord in 2025.
Next Tuesday is Touch Your Boss at Work Day.
You're talking about the illegal kind of discrimination. It's still discrimination to blatantly pay more for external people for no other reason than that they are external, it's just not illegal to do so. Evil and immoral, but not illegal.
I wonder if the ivory tower clowns in NYC ever look at the 'dimensions of diversity' wheel or notice how often they de-----e all over it with a lying smile on their face.
Many people are here because they are too old to get a job at another bank. Unscrupulous managers know and use this.
Ageism traps workers, hurting both them and banks.
Discrimination usually pertains to protected classes.
@orz+1t5kc5zM Because you aren’t forced to take the offer. It’s voluntary, that’s how.
Someone explain how this isn’t wage theft.🤷🏻
What is the incentive to moving internally for a promotion now? Or why would anyone even do it?
Not sure what others are experiencing, but as a prospective external hire, WF lowballed me and were completely unwilling to negotiate. They also tried to lie to me about the discretionary bonus. Obviously I declined the offer.
While you're at it, just look for a job outside of WF. Don't waste any more of your precious time on this s#!+ Place
True. They will look at your total comp to see where you are. If they feel you are well compensated, no raise. Mind boggling to me as a manager. No motivation to get promoted.
So external employees can negotiate and ask for anything they want, but internal employees can’t. How is that not discrimination?
I recently got a new position, same exact job and pay grade and they tried to lower my salary! It was tough trying to get them to match my salary and I’m below the midpoint range!
Wouldn't surprise me. They also appear to have lowered their offers for external hires as well.
Hey, who's feeling super appreciated right now? I know I am! 😐