Did you receive the email from HR on it? It’s ridiculous to ask for, at least, 30 days for VP-level or above.
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@ve I believe your $2000 post asset cap award that came with an agreements that included this policy ..so if you accepted that’…
If you don't get RSRs, I'm not sure what they could do to you if you don't follow the policy. There are no real retirement benefits, and if you are retiring you don't care if you're eligible for rehire or not. I suppose they could use your PTO days to cover the notice period, but that'd be the same as paying you for them on departure.
What, exactly, can they take away from you?
People were happy about the fancy, inflated titles...now we know WF doesn't do a single thing for the benefit of employees. It was to serve themselves and lock us into staying.
It does appear there is enough weasel language in the RSR agreements that they can expire them if you don’t comply, and maybe even have you pay back the last vested amount. This shouldn’t matter if you are not retirement eligible, since you wouldn’t keep vesting anyway (and hopefully would be getting a sign on bonus from the new job to cover it). But if you are retirement eligible, it’s a strong consideration. WF trying once again to show how much they value their employees. Isn’t that this month?
I’m an at will employee. I have no contract.
Haven't signed anything related to this so...
We have a contract. if you sign an agreement (often an employment contract or even an employee handbook acknowledgment) that says you’ll give 60 or 90 days’ notice, then you’re legally bound to comply. It’s essentially a contractual obligation layered on top of the at-will default.
The company can “ask” for anything. Whether they have a case for breach of contract is doubtful.
And all of this is happening under a guy who refused to move away from NY when he started with this place. Chainsaw chucky is the monopoly player here.
I sense another big announcement soon, making WF work life even worse. This sounds like leadership putting protection (fear) in place first. Rumors have been swirling about required 8 hours a day in office and upping office days to 5. That will make people look outside the company, so now WF possibly recoups RSRs and has an excuse to never rehire you, if you don’t follow the policy. Can morale get any worse at this company?
Wy would HY exposes itself to more legal trouble. Why?
next thing you know they will make us disclose all our personal investments and make us get pre approval before we can make any trades... oh wait, thru already do that.
very few companies are willing to wait 60 days for someone, regardless of how great they are. the problem, this may be standard operating procedure for actual executives , but we are officers in name only. am executive director here is just a high level IC, any other company an executive director is running a large group.
Most people have no contract and are at will so you can leave today and never come back. However, any bonus or even an eligible to rehire may be affected. So of you are okay burning your bridges you can give one minute notice.
@ee you should get the S-B and retain the RSRs. Hiring the right person is so difficult that if you’re the right person they’ll let you take your garden leave if the policy even affects you in your state.
The company you go to will likely buy those RSRs through a sign on bonus.
If your state is an AT WILL state:
At-will employment:
This doctrine means that both employers and employees can terminate the employment relationship at any time, for any reason, or no reason at all, unless there is a specific contract or law in place to the contrary.
Complete BS. No contract, you can leave anytime you want. There are no federal or state laws requiring any of this; it is up to the employee on how much or little time they give the company. No loyalty on their part, none on yours. If they try to sc--w folks on RSRs, a good lawyer would be all over that. What a toxic mess this place is.
during next week Town Hall everyone should ask why he is forcing a notice period when those of us he is laying off get none
or if you don't care about your RSUs. It will be interesting to see how this plays out in the courts especially if they try to modify existing restricted stock rights agreements. even if the language in previously signed agreement leans towards them being able to modify at a later date, they would still on most cases be required to get our written approval. I guess they could do that by tieing to acceptance of future agreements. for those of us in specialty markets with very few internal prospects, I'll give them 2 weeks of I find another job and they aren't willing to budge on a start date. d1-k move WF
@ac exactly. If you don't have RSUs and/or don't care about rehire status, give as much or as little notice as you want.
guess they figure those of us that are able to find employment elsewhere and leaving on our own are actually valuable and therefore us leaving is causing harm. Maybe they should look in the mirror to fix why people are leaving on their own instead of trying to keep us here against our will. As for sr. leaders who disappear for a few months and then "retire" that will still happen because they will be granted exceptions unlike us rank and file officers.
I would take the last 2 weeks of PTO to start in the new job.
Moral of the story- you don’t get off this sinking ship unless we throw you off. Agree that this reeks of desperation. Reminds me of that day Enron prevented employees from selling their stocks. No good signaling coming from this comm.
But - might not be terrible to curb senior managers from disappearing for months and then poof retiring. Happens a lot around here.
@cg The remaining RSR’s so I guess post tax . Bit all my RSR’s vested on their original vesting schedule, so why are you concerned with losing RSR’s?
@cx Nope
Do we have to RTO during the notice period?
This seems like a ploy to rob, steal and stick it to those that decide to leave on their own. It may be trying to salvage and keep talent but this company doesn’t seem to care about how low they go so if they can clawback RSRs and or not pay them all the better. .
They hand out VP-titles like candy in this place...
so when they try to claw back your previous years vested RSRs, do they take the pretax amount or post tax amount?
Laughable that the same geniuses that implemented zero-day working notice (your access is shut off the same day they lay you off) now want you to give them 30, 60, or 90 days notice to quit. What happened to "insider threat"? Makes no sense.
I guess they better start giving us more RSRs then.
clawback only affects new grants and only goes back 1 year so if I quit without proper notice after this coming bonus, those grants won't start vesting until 2027 so no clawback until then.
How about this: can you formally renounce your officer title?
And people say Officer Titles are useless. 🤣🤣
@aj yeah I was thinking the clawback only can happen under terms of new grants.
Did the HR communique provide any rationale or just the usual flowery vapid doublespeak?
This is a brilliant maneuver by HY. Now, instead of people leaving the day after their bonus hits their account, it'll be 30/60/90 days after it hits their account, if they even care about this unenforceable rule. Problem solved! 😐
Sign of desperation and exodus of key talent.
I’m waiting for the policy to be rescinded. It implies there’s an employment contract, but there’s no consideration btw.
So when they want to change my job or eliminate my position, better slow your roll there. We have a contract, because I have to give you 30-90 days notice before I’m allowed to leave or you “may take any and all actions, subject to applicable law.” You can’t have it both ways. And, it’s so egregious an employment lawyer will take the case on contingency because at a minimum they’re getting their attorney fees. Hey HR, has an employment attorney even looked at this?
I don’t think this is legally enforceable in at-will work states, like California. Also, regarding RSRs, my grant states the business roles that are subject to notice, and it’s much more limited than the broad new policy, so don’t think that’s really going to be an issue for most that weren’t already impacted.